Prostitution thread -- split from "Ipswich Ripper"

[Arch Deviant]

Whatever this guy's motive (and I don't think there's any doubt the killer will turn out to be male) it only serves to prove why prostitution should be legal in this country. Whatever moral view point you want to take, men will always be willing to pay for sex and there will be women desperate enough to supply it. At least with state sanctioned brothels these women would have some protection, which is more than they've got walking the streets.
And for those desperate to feed their addictions, some decent drug rehabilitation programmes wouldn't go amiss, rather than jail time (because we all know how difficult it is to get drugs in prison).

Clearly nutters like this will always find an opportunity, but sometimes it seems as though society goes out of its way to ensure there's a supply of victims.

Perhaps if society made an effort to evolve into a place where prostitution and drug rehab programmes aren't needed then society may become a more peaceful place. Obeying instincts is what makes us more animal than human.

*cough*... never heard of prostitution and drug abuse amongst animals.

No, I haven't.

[markfiend]

Markfiend, you are neatly ignoring where you said I'd rather see these women dead than plying their trade near me, which I did not say. I said that a state-sanctioned brothel wouldn't have protected them, and I gave reasons. And yes, I sure as hell wouldn't want a brothel near where I lived. You don't object, then fine, have them near your home, I swear I'll never use their services, so no NIMBY-ism.

Yes, I'll concede that. Sorry. As 9w9 rightly says, I have a tendency to jump the wrong conclusion from a standing start.

I do apologise.

[robertzombie]

It is sad that these girls have been murdered, leaving their families and/or children without a daughter/mother but.
They are doing something which is illegal. They can decide if they want to go through with it or not. They're the ones that have decided to become prostitutes, (if they're doing it to feed drug addiction then, quite frankly, it's their own fault for becoming drug addicts) so if something goes wrong, if they do end up being murdered then really it's their own fault.
They know the dangers of the job, theirs plenty of other, legal, safer ways to earn money.

I don't want to start an argument because I can see that a lot of you won't agree with me, but that's just my opinion.

[Francis]

... was entirely NIMBYism.

Some of us remember you being unsettled by terrorists in your back yard Mark.

[canon docre]

It is sad that these girls have been murdered, leaving their families and/or children without a daughter/mother but.
They are doing something which is illegal. They can decide if they want to go through with it or not. They're the ones that have decided to become prostitutes, (if they're doing it to feed drug addiction then, quite frankly, it's their own fault for becoming drug addicts) so if something goes wrong, if they do end up being murdered then really it's their own fault.
They know the dangers of the job, theirs plenty of other, legal, safer ways to earn money.

I don't want to start an argument because I can see that a lot of you won't agree with me, but that's just my opinion.

When you don't want an argument why did you write this rubbish in the first place? I don't get it... it's kinda like saying: Huhuhu - I cant assemble my thoughts coherently and what comes out is a pile of s**t... but please please don't shoot me for it, cause I just wanted to get it out...

My advice in that case: just swallow your silly thesis down if you're not up for seeing it ripped to pieces.

Peace

[James Blast]

if they do end up being murdered then really it's their own fault

Are you daft!?

[canon docre]

re-considering my initial rant I actually would like to emphasise why your argument is wrong. (without swearing I promise!)

Imagine you drive in your car to school (or wherever). Suddenly another car crashes into yours and you're dead. It came out, that the driver was a drunkard.
Wouldnt you agree that this accident is entirely your own fault, because you knew before how dangerous it is to drive? Just take a look into the statistics on how many people die every year in car crashes, but still you choose to go by car, which makes yourself alone responsible for your death. Not?

[9while9]

re-considering my initial rant I actually would like to emphasise why your argument is wrong. (without swearing I promise!)

Imagine you drive in your car to school (or wherever). Suddenly another car crashes into yours and you're dead. It came out, that the driver was a drunkard.
Wouldnt you agree that this accident is entirely your own fault, because you knew before how dangerous it is to drive? Just take a look into the statistics on how many people die every year in car crashes, but still you choose to go by car, which makes yourself alone responsible for your death. Not?

I completely understand what robertzombie is trying to say.
That the woman who goes into that kind of profession knows damn well that they are putting themselves into a Perilous Situation.
So you can expect circumstances that reflect this.

He's not saying that they are not people worthy of compassion or that it is ok for some psycho to kill them.

[canon docre]

I completely understand what robertzombie is trying to say.
That the woman who goes into that kind of profession knows damn well that they are putting themselves into a Perilous Situation.
So you can expect circumstances that reflect this.

He's not saying that they are not people worthy of compassion or that it is ok for some psycho to kill them.

Did I say so?

9w9, didnt you just accuse Markfiend of kneejerk assumptions? Well, then read my post again more carefully.

I was just emphasising why it is wrong to assume a crime (any) is the victims fault. Maybe once more just for you, yankee:
A crime is not the victims fault.

If you didnt get my car crash example then here's one easier:
Little girl walks to school. Man kidnappes her, rapes her and kills her. Her fault because she must know that walking alone on the street is dangerous?

Don't twist responsibilities here. The Ipswich killer is not allowed to kill these women just because they were easy to get.

[James Blast]

I completely understand what robertzombie is trying to say.

I don't, he's being simplistic and daft. I'm with Jess

[9while9]

read my post again more carefully!

What the hell do you hink the last
sentance in my post means?

"He's not saying that they are not people worthy of compassion or that it is ok for some psycho to kill them."

It seems to me you just want to argue...

Yankee..ouch.....

[9while9]

I completely understand what robertzombie is trying to say.

I don't, he's being simplistic and daft. I'm with Jess

Fair enough,
you are entitled to your own view on all the world's troubles..

[Izzy HaveMercy]

*cough*... never heard of ... drug abuse amongst animals.

Just to put a light note into this otherwise very serious discussion...

Apparently you haven't seen our tom sharing catnip with the neighbouring feline community yet


Otherwise, I am with the people in favor of 'sheltered' bordellos. Maybe not legal as such, but something like the Dutch policy on drugs ('gedoogbeleid' in Dutch, something like a 'tolerance policy' in English); easier to control and easier to react when horrors like this happen. Also a good start to weed out the pimps...

IZ.

[9while9]

*cough*... never heard of ... drug abuse amongst animals.

Just to put a light note into this otherwise very serious discussion...

Apparently you haven't seen our tom sharing catnip with the neighbouring feline community yet


Otherwise, I am with the people in favor of 'sheltered' bordellos. Maybe not legal as such, but something like the Dutch policy on drugs ('gedoogbeleid' in Dutch, something like a 'tolerance policy' in English); easier to control and easier to react when horrors like this happen. Also a good start to weed out the pimps...

IZ.

You are so very very WRONG!

Actually I'm kidding Izzy, but it cracks me up when people jump all over a comment that is really harmless.

[Izzy HaveMercy]

*cough*... never heard of ... drug abuse amongst animals.

Just to put a light note into this otherwise very serious discussion...

Apparently you haven't seen our tom sharing catnip with the neighbouring feline community yet


Otherwise, I am with the people in favor of 'sheltered' bordellos. Maybe not legal as such, but something like the Dutch policy on drugs ('gedoogbeleid' in Dutch, something like a 'tolerance policy' in English); easier to control and easier to react when horrors like this happen. Also a good start to weed out the pimps...

IZ.

You are so very very WRONG!

Actually I'm kidding Izzy, but it cracks me up when people jump all over a comment that is really harmless.

Some comments, in some threads, where a certain kind of emotion is going on, are not always taken as lightly as you intended them to be, 9w9.

Always be prepared for that, and always try to accept the joke is only on you sometimes...

IZ.

[9while9]

Just to put a light note into this otherwise very serious discussion...

Apparently you haven't seen our tom sharing catnip with the neighbouring feline community yet


Otherwise, I am with the people in favor of 'sheltered' bordellos. Maybe not legal as such, but something like the Dutch policy on drugs ('gedoogbeleid' in Dutch, something like a 'tolerance policy' in English); easier to control and easier to react when horrors like this happen. Also a good start to weed out the pimps...

IZ.

You are so very very WRONG!

Actually I'm kidding Izzy, but it cracks me up when people jump all over a comment that is really harmless.

Some comments, in some threads, where a certain kind of emotion is going on, are not always taken as lightly as you intended them to be, 9w9.

Always be prepared for that, and always try to accept the joke is only on you sometimes...

IZ.

I'll take that one to heart........

[canon docre]

read my post again more carefully!

What the hell do you hink the last
sentance in my post means?

"He's not saying that they are not people worthy of compassion or that it is ok for some psycho to kill them."

how would you interpret this sentence?

so if something goes wrong, if they do end up being murdered then really it's their own fault.

apart from that I'm of course very very happy that robertzombie thinks prostitutes are worth of compassion (like any other human being.)

It seems to me you just want to argue...

Quite frankly yes. Look, robertzombie is a very young chap who seemingly hasnt got enough wisdom/knowledge yet to judge legal matters in a logic way. So why not trying to bring across one of the fundamental buttresses (sic! ) of civilized legal system?

[robertzombie]

Like I said, I don't want to start an argument, we can't all have the same opinions about something, if we did life would be pretty boring.

If it were 5 innocent women that had been killed then yes, I would be totally against it. But the fact that they're prostitutes just makes me feel a bit less sorry for them because of the fact that they're doing something that is illegal and frowned upon.

Yes they have families, yes any murder is bad, but personally I would feel a lot more sorry for them if they weren't prostitutes.

[nick the stripper]

we can't all have the same opinions about something, if we did life would be pretty boring.

True, but life would also be rather boring, and incredibly frustrating, if we just smiled, nodded politely, and said nothing whenever someone says something we disagree with. Also, progress towards a better world would be slowed if you keep your mouth shut whenever you hear someone say a view such as yours or that homosexuals who have aids deserved it (I know way too many people who believe this).

Yes they have families, yes any murder is bad, but personally I would feel a lot more sorry for them if they weren't prostitutes.

Do you have any reason to dislike prostitutes more than other members other society besides because prostitution is illegal?

[robertzombie]

Isn't the fact that it's illegal a good enough reason to be against it?

Something like this might make others think twice before turning to prostitution. You never know, some good may come from it.

[nick the stripper]

Isn't the fact that it's illegal a good enough reason to be against it?

No, it's not a good reason to hold prostitutes lower and more deserving of murder than others.

Something like this might make others think twice before turning to prostitution. There's two sides to every coin.

You're right. We should start hanging junkies to teach impressionable teens that if they experiment, they're dead.

[robertzombie]

It's clear that the reason these women were killed is becuase they're prostitutes. If they weren't prostitutes then maybe this wouldn't have happened.
It's not like they had no other choice.

[nick the stripper]

If they weren't prostitutes then maybe this wouldn't have happened.

Or maybe it wouldn't have happened if brothels were legalized over here, and there were more police on the beat.

It's not like they had no other choice.

Actually, recently there was a special on the BBC that said a lot of prostitutes are runaways from abusive homes, bankrupt, or broke and have children to feed, and this is their only way of making money. It just so happened that the five he murdered were drug addicts. So basically, what you are saying is that women all across Europe are more deserving of murder simply because of they have to sell their body for an income.

[robertzombie]

I'm sure McDonalds would've taken them

[nick the stripper]

I'm sure McDonalds would've taken them

Sure, because McDonalds pays enough money for food, rent, electricity, etc. etc.