RIP Saddam Hussein

[itnAklipse]

Yes, i'm glad the execution of Saddam went as badly as it did. i am sorry that he suffered, but happy the world was faced with the brutality of his enemies and the good character of Saddam himself. In imprisonment he showed himself to be a man of great moral stature, and of great integrity.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1981148,00.html

eotunun: i don't understand how your quote would support Weltner being a white supremacist. He's stating a factual event of jews killing white people, possibly implying that jews might be the real haters? There's also evidence of jews starting nazi groups and jews funding nazis in WWII...make sense of that.

markfiend: i think the correctness of one's decisions is not decided by how dangerous they are, but if they are made with pure heart. Life is dangerous and we all travel but to our graves, what matters is whether or not we live up to our own ideals or not, and we if cultivate those ideas through our actions regardless of the end...by which i mean taht in a world where the very basis of general conception of morality is as shaky as ours, a moral person might seem the least moral of all.
Even Kant, whom i despise to no end, was of the opinion, and here i agree with him, that morality of the act is not decided by its outcome at all, as is a very common conception these days, but by the actual act itself. That is to say, not by how many lives you save or lose, but if the act itself is pure.

[Purple Light]

@ itnAklipse

Go put some Sisters on & chill out.












& just so you don't respond with something like "You'll post in this thread about me but don't have an opinion yourself on the subject...."


Saddam should rot in solitary for the rest of his life, in my opinion.

[markfiend]

Well, to take the point you address to me:

i think the correctness of one's decisions is not decided by how dangerous they are, but if they are made with pure heart.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. We're already way past Godwin's law in this topic, so I'll point out that a lot of the SS guards were operating the ovens at Auschwitz with (what they thought were) the best of intentions; it may have been personally distasteful to kill the poor Untermensch, but it was for the good of the Reich and for the good of the Volk. What purer purpose could a good Nazi serve?

And this is the point; this is why a morality such as the one you espouse is utterly bankrupt. It's completely amoral to use "purity of purpose" as an excuse for virtually anything. Utilitarian morality is the only objective way we can have of measuring goodness or badness; by the effects it has on other people.

There's also evidence of jews starting nazi groups and jews funding nazis in WWII...make sense of that.

Quite frankly I'd be surprised if you could actually show any of this evidence.

[boudicca]

Yes, i'm glad the execution of Saddam went as badly as it did. i am sorry that he suffered, but happy the world was faced with the brutality of his enemies and the good character of Saddam himself. In imprisonment he showed himself to be a man of great moral stature, and of great integrity.

And therin lies the reason this shouldn't have been done. Man of great moral stature my arse - he has been given integrity (in the eyes of some at least) where he deserves none.

But quite frankly that is a side issue now. What I found most worrying about those comments that the executioners made was that they will infuriate the Suni insurgents, they will see Saddam's execution as a sectarian issue. And that's another couple of hundred innocent Shi'ite women and children blown up.

[boudicca]

Saddam should rot in solitary for the rest of his life, in my opinion.

Not much of a sentence then

[Purple Light]

Saddam should rot in solitary for the rest of his life, in my opinion.

Not much of a sentence then

I'm a man of few words.

[EvilBastard]

Given that Osama bin Laden has been trying to get rid of Saddam for years (on the grounds that he was standing in the way of Mr. binLaden's goal of a fundamentalist superstate), it's good to see that ObL and Bush are both singing from the same carol sheet, isn't it? Bush gets to execute the guy "who threatened my dad", the Sunnis get their own martyr for eid, and Osama is one step closer to realising his dream - choc-ices all 'round, I reckon.

[Quiff Boy]

http://www.notesofintelligence.com/infl ... mmary.html

Selling your Ideas: Establish a Space for Cooperation

• Avoid arguments: you can only lose.
  • Arguers will defend and embrace their previous positions.
  • Even “winningâ€� will hurt the loser’s pride and build resentment.
  • A Guide to avoiding arguments:
    1. Welcome the disagreement. Be thankful for a new opinion.
    2. Stay calm.
    3. Listen first. Hear your opponents out.
    4. Identify areas of agreement.
    5. Admitting errors will make it easier for others to admit theirs.
    6. If no resolution is found, postpone action and promise to explore the opposing perspective.

[boudicca]

Yes sir.

*shuffles off*

[smiscandlon]

If no resolution is found, postpone action and promise to explore the opposing perspective.

Right. I'm off to check out ****. Anyone want to join me?

[Izzy HaveMercy]

If no resolution is found, postpone action and promise to explore the opposing perspective.

Right. I'm off to check out ****. Anyone want to join me?

I did, as said before. It reeks like a sewer.


IZ.

[markfiend]

Right. I'm off to check out ****. Anyone want to join me?

I can't stomach it for longer than a few minutes but I'm willing to guess that both The Protocols of the Elders of Zion and the Blood Libel are in there somewhere

See also Wiki on ****: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jew_Watch

[smiscandlon]

Right. I'm off to check out ****. Anyone want to join me?

I can't stomach it for longer than a few minutes but I'm willing to guess that both The Protocols of the Elders of Zion and the Blood Libel are in there somewhere

See also Wiki on ****: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jew_Watch

Actually, I was only joking as I don't think I could bring myself to even look at it. I know how insidious these things can be ... maybe that makes me the one with prejudices, but I think I'll take that risk.

[markfiend]

Fair enough.

A look at the wiki article justifies your prejudice I think.

[scotty]

In imprisonment he showed himself to be a man of great moral stature, and of great integrity.

you crack me up

[eotunun]

..(Saddam).. a man of great moral stature, and of great integrity.

In the same way as Al Capone or Stalin. "Good means good for me"
There´s enough evidence for the oposite.
Most who got to know him described him as unpredictable and selfish. Those are not traits the morality for a social being would judge as "good"

eotunun: i don't understand how your quote would support Weltner being a white supremacist. He's stating a factual event of jews killing white people, possibly implying that jews might be the real

Note: Most Jews are white. The jewish religion has been a part of the european history since the early medieval days! You may condemn germans, english or fins just as well for killing white folks. The mere mentioning that they were "white children" implies
A) he thinks non-whites may not kill whites and
B) killing non-white is okay..
What else is that than racialism that is expressed there?
The combination of antisemitic and racialism is smelling enough of sh*t to call it a turd.
I have the impression you tend to agree to racialistic ideas, itnAklipse.. Nae good in my book!
No-fuckin´-body has a right to kill anyone!

I can´t give you any evidence of that, Mark. But I wouldn´t be surprised to find it. As mentioned above Jews allways were an integral part of the society of germany and it´s ancestor states. In WW 1´s german army a lot of the officers were Jews. There also were nationalists between them, as religion simply didn´t matter until Hitler and his sect decided the Jews were guilty of Versaille´s treaty, which did bite all nationalists, causing the Reich to drown in meaninglessness. German nationalists who happened to be jewish and didn´t really look at what else than ranting at the traty Hitler was saying. After all Hitler was laughed at by most of the establishment (the monarchists), and the ultraconservative circles wanted to get rid of him once he had done what they wanted of him. But by that time he controlled the mob in the streets, and the monarchists were in about as much of control of the situation as a fly on the windscreen...

Given that Osama bin Laden has been trying to get rid of Saddam for years (on the grounds that he was standing in the way of Mr. binLaden's goal of a fundamentalist superstate), it's good to see that ObL and Bush are both singing from the same carol sheet, isn't it? Bush gets to execute the guy "who threatened my dad", the Sunnis get their own martyr for eid, and Osama is one step closer to realising his dream - choc-ices all 'round, I reckon.

Aye!
If I am going to ask who may have pushed into the death sentence for Saddam, I´ll first take a look at the parties inside Iraq!
But then: This ending to Saddam´s story was predictable. See Mussolini or Hitler for comparison.

[Badlander]

I'm starting to be a bit worried : this Jew Watch thingy seems highly disturbing to me, and I don't like the idea of contributor(s) to this forum thinking so lightly of it.
You know what ? Supporters of Jean-Marie Le Pen, leader of the French National Front, think he's a very neat old man, they honestly do. They think he's honest, he's courageous, he stands by his principles...
And yet Le Pen did commit torture during the Algeria war. And yet he did release Nazi records on his own label in the 60s.
Nazis and all kind of fascists aren't stupid, if they were it wouldn't be a even fight. They know very well how to look respectable... which makes them all the more dangerous.
It's not enough to just take a look at the websites and/or the publications, you also have to get an idea of the context, of the subtext, and basically of who these people are.
I gather Scientology is a very cool way to pass the time. I mean, if you read the pamphlets only.

[EvilBastard]

I'm starting to be a bit worried : this Jew Watch thingy seems highly disturbing to me, and I don't like the idea of contributor(s) to this forum thinking so lightly of it.
It's not enough to just take a look at the websites and/or the publications, you also have to get an idea of the context, of the subtext, and basically of who these people are.

I agree that **** is disturbing (although no more so than www.jtf.org, for example - idiots are idiots, the only variable is politics) - however, it is vital that such sites exist:
1. Freedom of speech (no matter how hateful we believe it to be) is paramount
2. It's a question of Know Your Enemy - if we know what these people are saying, what they believe, and how they justify it, then we can formulate a strategy to beat them, to expose them for the empty vessels that they are.

[Dark]

If I want to watch a Jew, I'll watch The Daily Show with Jon Stewart.

[EvilBastard]

If I want to watch a Jew, I'll watch The Daily Show with Jon Stewart.

Bu-dumm TISH!

[Izzy HaveMercy]

If I want to watch a Jew, I'll watch The Daily Show with Jon Stewart.

I just have to go to work

IZ.

[itnAklipse]

Badlander: Yes, **** purpose is to document the real history of jews, not as they document it through their PR but as it is really. i don't think Weltner would deny that. That is the context of the site. Anything wrong with that?

And if you look around the site for a bit, you will easily find the evidence for jews financing nazis and supporting Hitler, if i remember correctly Walburg-family was one of those. And if you read more about it, i think anyone with an open mind would have to agree that it was not as innocent as Evilbastard, who obviously has no qualms about having extreme prejudice against anyone who might think badly of the Golden People, would like to suggest it was.

If i believed in fairness of the public opinion here, i would search for the links myself, but since i believe that would be useless because no one would dare to read them, i'd be just wasting my time.

Some people always think any evidence related to the crimes of the jews are innocent...oh they were just an integral part of germany haha. That's right, they were, but you can't hide the truth behind their intentions behind that claptrap. They rose Hitler to power, promoted anti-semitism etc.

i could recommend books on the subject but of course you wouldn't want to touch such books with a stick. So much for the proverbial "other side".

Disturbing? My opinion is that **** is a Godsend. i would've never, for example, known that bolsheviks were jews and the french revolution was a jewish revolution and the values promoted in it were jewish values etc. had i not stumbled upon that site.

PS: i suppose i must mention, otherwise i'll be labelled as an evil "anti-semite", that i have no problem with jewish people as a race or religion, i have a problem with jewish people who do certain things, starting from the Rothschilds...and it is very true that people of every race and creed are in bed with them.

Do you know that George Bush is quoted as saying (i hope the quote is ad verbatim): "i'm just one man in the middle of the jewish lobbyists"? Think about that.

Or did you know that when Giuliani was elected mayor, the first group he went to talk to was the jews of NY?

Or that rabbis flock the white house and Bush lights up menorahs for them, when religion and state are supposed to be separate, and he's certainly not having anything Christian in the white house because that would be politically incorrect.

[Badlander]

PS: i suppose i must mention, otherwise i'll be labelled as an evil "anti-semite", that i have no problem with jewish people as a race or religion, i have a problem with jewish people who do certain things, starting from the Rothschilds...and it is very true that people of every race and creed are in bed with them.

A RACE ?!

[Izzy HaveMercy]

Hmmm.

*shakes laptop and wifi USB-stick*

I think mine's broke. Can anyone see any posts of mine here? I think Finnish web-hoppers can't, apparently.

Oh, and ItnAklipse, Bush also stated that the Iraq war was necessary, and that there is nothing wrong with our environment, and if it is, is is really NOT the major fault of the oil companies. Do you believe that too without further thinking?

I went to that Jew Watch site. Did you check regular history for a change, just to have some hard facts?

I quoted that feller from Over There, I did not see you reply to that one. How come?

Then again, I wouldn't be surprised at all that you think all history written down is a Jewish conspiracy to hide the truth.

Don't take me wrong, doubting things that people say is not a bad trait in itself, doubting history and facts, on the other hand, is dangerous...

IZ.

[Izzy HaveMercy]

PS: i suppose i must mention, otherwise i'll be labelled as an evil "anti-semite", that i have no problem with jewish people as a race or religion, i have a problem with jewish people who do certain things, starting from the Rothschilds...and it is very true that people of every race and creed are in bed with them.

A RACE ?!

He means a People

IZ.