When You Don't See Me

[MrChris]

Was thinking about this the other day. The obvious interpretation is that it's directed at a certain person, who doesn't really understand AE, wants him to be someone he isn't, and who needs to wise up. Or, in fact, find someone else to obsess about. But there is another possibility , which is that, much like FALAA, it's actually directed at (certain) fans. Which would be much more interesting. Waddyareckon?

[Black Shuck]

Personally, I don't think Von would sing a song about his fans; he never ever mentions his fans in interviews etc., I don't think it would be characteristic to address them in one of his songs.
It's more likely to be about a specific person

I thought it was kinda funny when they played this song live (I saw them in Leeds), Indeed I couldn't see Von at all for the duration of the song.

[MrChris]

Hmm, could be just me, then. Personally, I've frequently seen AE discuss his fans in interviews, and as I said, AE has acknowledged that First and Last and Always is about his fans. But perhaps this one is less straightforward...

Who knows?

[paint it black]

Hmm, could be just me, then. Personally, I've frequently seen AE discuss his fans in interviews,

Yup,

A special discerning breed of pond life

[Jim]

I reckon the fans angle is pretty good. otherwise it starts to look like romantic twaddle, and that's not his style (two worlds apart not withstanding...)

[Jim]

I'm gonna go have another listen, but from memory it's sounding more and more plausible - "you bought a mask, i put it on"

His way of escaping the g*** tag - i.e. it was never his choice, he just played along (which is bollocks obviously, but who are we to dismiss his little fantasies)

[MrChris]

Well, glad someone sees what I'm getting at. Perhaps I'm not mad after all . The thing is, as far as I know everyone has always seen it as just another song about a failed relationship, but I just can't buy into that. Maybe this is a case of the Emperor's new clothes, but to me it reads equally well the other way. AE has, let us say, an ambivalent relationship with some of his fans, as anyone at the recent Wolverhampton gig could testify. I shall go and listen to it too

[James]

In the I was wrong Interview from 91, AE said he wrote it from the ponit of view of a particular band member, to that band member's girlfriend, because the girlfriend did not really see the full picture of what went on when she wasn't around.

[khepri II]

You bought a mask, I put it on
You never thought to ask me
If I wear it when you're gone

this song has many Jungian references. Non?

Is it possible, mibbie this is because I'm prone to a less than sunny disposition, that this isn't about his fanbase and live gigging?

I think the mask he refers to is an illusory faux happiness for/ because of his guest's presence.

The fact that said guest doesn't see this is what makes it such an angry little song

[mh]

Nah, it's definitely about public perception, and a wee shot at people who think that a public image reflects one's private persona.

[MrChris]

Yeah, I think so too. I think the other, more obvious explanation (you personally don't understand me, I have to pretend to be someone else - the Jung isn't necessary to get this point, I don't think) works too on a simpler level, but I think there's space for both.

[mh]

Space for both is maybe the way it is, knowing Von there would have to be a double meaning, eh?

Maybe it's a dig at a certain type of Sisters fan. Those who think only Von understands them, so he writes a song that on the surface seems to be for them, but dig a little deeper and he's really saying "hey, I ain't like that actually".

[Quiff Boy]

Space for both is maybe the way it is, knowing Von there would have to be a double meaning, eh?

Maybe it's a dig at a certain type of Sisters fan. Those who think only Von understands them, so he writes a song that on the surface seems to be for them, but dig a little deeper and he's really saying "hey, I ain't like that actually".

now that's entirely plausible

[MrChris]

Hey, the world is coming around. Today mh and Quiffboy, tomorrow the White House.

[mayhem]

I found it very funny that each night they played this on the last tour they would completely smoke the place out & then let the photographers in...


M

[more-sedatives-pls]

was just listening to this song and some old philosophy course clicked in what is left of my brain.

the more I think about it, the more I am convinced that the basis for WYDSM can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_stage

get real...
get another!

[limur]

It’s probably a mulit-layered meaning but I always take it to be written about being in a claustrophobic relationship, whereby the “I” acts how the “you” wants them to act but the “I” becomes themselves when the “you” leaves.

“I don't exist when you don't see me
I don't exist when you're not here”

The chorus especially gives the impression that the fake “I” doesn’t exist when the “you” is not around.

“What the eye don't see won't break the heart”

The real “I” can act as themselves without disappointing the “you”

“You can make believe when we're apart”

Whereas the “you” can go on believing that the “I” is the person they believe them to be, even though they do not act as they do when they're together when they're apart.

“But when you leave I disappear”

The fake “I” that exists when the two are together disappears when the “you” leaves.

Also the second verse;

“Oh, it's kind of different when your there”

The “I” acts differently when the “you” is there.

“You can lease the peace of mind”

To ease the tension between the two and act as expected in the relationship

“You bought a mask, I put it on”

“You” expects “I” to act as “I” acts when “you” is around. The mask image especially ties in with;

“You never thought to ask me, if I wear it when you're gone”

“You” is so rapped up in themselves and “I” as the person they expect “I” to be that, when “you” don’t see “I”, it doesn’t occur to “you” that “I” might well take the mask off when “you” don’t see “me” (if you follow... )

“Get real, get another”

“I” wants out. Born out by;

“You never learned
You bought me
Everything and less
I turned
You couldn't let me move”

“You” thought that “I” wanted everything and more, but all “I” really wanted was a bit of space. “And less” is placing emphasis on “everything” being viewed as worthless by “I”.

And then to finish the “I” goes on to talk about what the “you” is missing;

“I guess, I don't deny, it don't disprove, what you see is what you lost”

“If I were you I wouldn't try”.

The “you” wouldn’t understand.

Possibly the most drivel I've ever written on a Friday, but it is the end of the week

[eastmidswhizzkid]

It’s probably a mulit-layered meaning but I always take it to be written about being in a claustrophobic relationship, whereby the “I� acts how the “you� wants them to act but the “I� becomes themselves when the “you� leaves.

“I don't exist when you don't see me
I don't exist when you're not here�

The chorus especially gives the impression that the fake “I� doesn’t exist when the “you� is not around.

“What the eye don't see won't break the heart�

The real “I� can act as themselves without disappointing the “you�

“You can make believe when we're apart�

Whereas the “you� can go on believing that the “I� is the person they believe them to be, even though they do not act as they do when they're together when they're apart.

“But when you leave I disappear�

The fake “I� that exists when the two are together disappears when the “you� leaves.

Also the second verse;

“Oh, it's kind of different when your there�

The “I� acts differently when the “you� is there.

“You can lease the peace of mind�

To ease the tension between the two and act as expected in the relationship

“You bought a mask, I put it on�

“You� expects “I� to act as “I� acts when “you� is around. The mask image especially ties in with;

“You never thought to ask me, if I wear it when you're gone�

“You� is so rapped up in themselves and “I� as the person they expect “I� to be that, when “you� don’t see “I�, it doesn’t occur to “you� that “I� might well take the mask off when “you� don’t see “me� (if you follow... )

“Get real, get another�

“I� wants out. Born out by;

“You never learned
You bought me
Everything and less
I turned
You couldn't let me move�

“You� thought that “I� wanted everything and more, but all “I� really wanted was a bit of space. “And less� is placing emphasis on “everything� being viewed as worthless by “I�.

And then to finish the “I� goes on to talk about what the “you� is missing;

“I guess, I don't deny, it don't disprove, what you see is what you lost�

“If I were you I wouldn't try�.

The “you� wouldn’t understand.

Possibly the most drivel I've ever written on a Friday, but it is the end of the week

wouldn't have said it quite like that but i totally agree. i would add that i get the feeling from the song of being ignored or neglected in the relationship and feeling that to the other person you are "out of sight out of mind"....perhaps this would eventualy lead to resentment and acromony and the end of the relationshipfeelings expressed in your version of the song?

fucking hell..i'm too stoned to be in the lyrics section!

[Carcharoth]

I used to think it was as simple as being about a failed relationship/a relationship on its way to falling apart, but after giving it some time, it does indeed seem to have a deeper meaning, implying simply that Eldo as a private person isn't like Eldo on stage and in the press. "You bought a mask, I put it on. You never thought to ask me if I wear it when you're gone" - you "bought" the image I put on as a public person, but you've never bothered pondering if I'm the same in private. So it seems it's meant as a sort of jab at the fans who expect Eldo to be some sort of goff overlord 24/7.

[Being645]

Space for both is maybe the way it is, knowing Von there would have to be a double meaning, eh?

Maybe it's a dig at a certain type of Sisters fan. Those who think only Von understands them, so he writes a song that on the surface seems to be for them, but dig a little deeper and he's really saying "hey, I ain't like that actually".

Hell, that were nice. But if you look at it a little deeper, you know that it don't work. Even worse, performed live it does create a pretty double-bind distorting every normal emotional affect when shouted into your face with some underlying And where then, where is your so-called "love"... (as happened widely in 2006 in my perception) ... so that all you can do to keep yourself on emotionally healthy grounds is switch over to silver screen mode and watch that creature up there with watchful interest at the utmost, but surely not with the joy and pleasures of attending a live gig with your favourite band ... ... and they were even proud of that ... ... not to mention the invidious rancorousness of all the self-announced Eldritch-representatives in your home-town who just couldn't get through to have you give them head ... or to whom you anyway represented nothing but a tart ...


What you see is what you lost ... ... sha-lala-lahhhh ...sha-la-la-la ...

But of course, you can read it on your ticket: no liability in case of any damages ...


* Shiver. I'm glad we're in 2012 now and dearly hope we're through and out these waters. Or as it is says in the introduction to the General Chat on this Forum:

Above all else, remember this: Anyone who had a heart would love me too.

It had all looked almost fine in 2011... ...