Contractual reasons for not releasing "new" materi

Yggdrasil · 15 Jan 2009, 18:39

Badlander wrote:
sultan2075 wrote: One thing that I don't think has been mentioned yet... after the "strike" against East/West, Von is probably kryptonite to record labels. If I were a label decision maker, I don't know if I'd want to invest any money in someone prone to that kind of approach to conflict resolution either
I remember a record company executive saying that if a young Bob Dylan showed up at his office today, he wouldn't sign it, just because the man is too much trouble. That alone says a lot about the state of the music industry.

Too true. And just try to imagine Bob Dylan, Johnny Rotten, Neil Young, Kate Bush, Roger Waters, Keith Richards, or hell, anyone with any personality and integrity who is any good, winning Pop Idol...

Badlander · 15 Jan 2009, 19:05

Yggdrasil wrote: Too true. And just try to imagine Bob Dylan, Johnny Rotten, Neil Young, Kate Bush, Roger Waters, Keith Richards, or hell, anyone with any personality and integrity who is any good, winning Pop Idol...

They'd be considered far too temperamental.

mh · 15 Jan 2009, 20:17

All of which begs the question - why the f--k is Von so hell-bent on a major-label contract anyway? The man ain't stupid, he has experience of what happened when things went round the U-bend with East West, he knows full well that the Record Industry is just a business like any other where making as much money as possible and in the shortest time possible for the top Execs is imperative #1. It would be incredibly naive of him to expect that any other big record company would be any different.

If he had any intention at all of releasing stuff, he'd be banging out low-budget independent releases and relying on the fanbase (who remain dedicated and would become moreso under such circumstances) to get sales. It works for other bands, some bigger and some smaller. It's a proven method, all it needs is the will to get the momentum going.

Which brings us back to the question of whether or not he seriously could be arsed.

crash_and_burn · 15 Jan 2009, 20:23

It really seems like Andrew doesn't care but needs the money, which he gets by touring. So, if we all stopped going to his concerts, we might get an album.

On another, very hypothetical note, I always wondered if he decided to release an album, if we would have any idea that it was coming (kind of like not advertising his tours). Or if it would show up in the shops, completely unannounced.

doctoravalanche · 15 Jan 2009, 20:30

crash_and_burn wrote:It really seems like Andrew doesn't care but needs the money, which he gets by touring.

Indeed but venues the Sisters play are getting smaller and smaller, soon they will play in a pub ... So that will not last forever ...

lazarus corporation · 15 Jan 2009, 21:36

doctoravalanche wrote:
crash_and_burn wrote:It really seems like Andrew doesn't care but needs the money, which he gets by touring.
Indeed but venues the Sisters play are getting smaller and smaller, soon they will play in a pub ... So that will not last forever ...

I'm sure that he has another source of income not related to the Sisters. And no, it's not selling the contents of the chemist's locked cupboards.

Yggdrasil · 15 Jan 2009, 22:04

mh wrote: Which brings us back to the question of whether or not he seriously could be arsed.

That, and the question if he is legally able to release records, even if he wants to.

mh · 15 Jan 2009, 22:04

lazarus corporation wrote:I'm sure that he has another source of income not related to the Sisters. And no, it's not selling the contents of the chemist's locked cupboards.

Iiiiiiiiiit's...

Speculation time!

Medical experiment volunteer?

Yggdrasil · 15 Jan 2009, 22:12

lazarus corporation wrote:I'm sure that he has another source of income not related to the Sisters.

He himself has said that he's making techno/club (? can't recall exactly) records anonymously on the side.

Maybe he's actually releasing stuff which isn't so totally underground, but we just don't know that he's involved. He sure wouldn't tell anyone at all, if he stands a risk of being sewed by a vindictive East-West (or perhaps some other record company).

The fact that he's touring with/as the Sisters shows that he either still cares about the Sisters music and legacy, or that he is in need of income, or hopefully both.

But hasn't anyone asked him about all this?

eotunun · 15 Jan 2009, 22:19

doctoravalanche wrote:
crash_and_burn wrote:It really seems like Andrew doesn't care but needs the money, which he gets by touring.
Indeed but venues the Sisters play are getting smaller and smaller, soon they will play in a pub ... So that will not last forever ...

Beg to differ, the Cologne, Hamburg and Brussels gigs already sold out. .only the ones I know of right now. There's quite some interest in the band.

Badlander · 15 Jan 2009, 22:55

Yggdrasil wrote: But hasn't anyone asked him about all this?

Easier said than done. He's apparently quite a solitary man, so you'd have to find someone closely connected to him first. And even if Ben and Chris had a clue, I'm pretty sure they'd keep their mouth shut tight. Besides, they already said they didn't really know him.

il duce · 16 Jan 2009, 12:45

If he had any intention at all of releasing stuff, he'd be banging out low-budget independent releases and relying on the fanbase (who remain dedicated and would become moreso under such circumstances) to get sales. It works for other bands, some bigger and some smaller. It's a proven method, all it needs is the will to get the momentum going.

Which brings us back to the question of whether or not he seriously could be arsed. [THIS IS A QUOTE; i have no idea how I failed with that]

I could not agree more. And that is what makes no sense. You do not even need a small indie label anymore, you can release downloads from your webpage and score 100% of the money. Or you can sell cd's only at the shows which is exactly where all his fans are anyway.

So NO he has no intention of ever releasing a album, and NO he can not be arsed.

And my opinion is still that IF he for some strange reason would release a new album. One with the "new" songs is just not good enough anymore. It has to be all new material with a bonus cd of either live in the studio or just live versions of the "new" songs we allready know by heart as a limited edition or free download with it or something. Because otherwise Axl Rose has won and that would be the end of the world. If Axl after a million years can produce more unheard material that sucks than Von then the world will stop spinning and we will all fall off and for ever spin through space.

dinky daisy · 16 Jan 2009, 12:49

Since Andrew's so keen on democracy, grass roots, liberalism etc. He should follow the Radiohead statement.

Just give us the album, or whatever you want to mention it ('list of songs') and we'll decide what to pay.

If he would be that kind, I would put a $100 payment just because I would be excited seeing news like that on their site.

(that would compensate the dreadful old goffs that get it for free)

j3 · 16 Jan 2009, 19:13

I agree that he could completely self release material at this point through the website. There are quite few bands that have doing things this way for a few years now. And there is really no cost factors for him to be concerned with other than the studio time. The only real problem that I can see is if it is indeed true that his old contract is barring him in some way. But a simple solution to getting around that would be to not SELL the downloads but ask for "donations" in either a set amount or let the individual choose for themselves. And most likely, if he decided to, this process could happen now as I'm 99% sure that most likely there are studio recordings of the "new" songs. It doesn't really cost that much to record if you are efficient with your time while doing it.

mh · 17 Jan 2009, 04:01

All true enough but I wouldn't be inclined to get too paranoid about it, y'know...

RobF · 17 Jan 2009, 11:23

j3 wrote:... It doesn't really cost that much to record if you are efficient with your time while doing it.

Which The Sisters never have been, especially Andrew, just look at the rest of the band's anecdotes fron VT. Literally WEEKS of vocal overdubs. He's not going to be happy with any studio he can afford without record company help, even a top whack UK studio. He'll want somewhere with quality live rooms, a decent range of analogue kit, and to be frank, probably a pool too. To himself. For months.

Yes, I know he's not going to get it... No album. It's extremely doubtful there would still be a contractual problem with him using the name or releasing material by this point. The record company have no need for it, they've royally shafted the man's career as it is.

Smallstone · 17 Jan 2009, 18:54

No major record label in the UK would sign Eldo/SOM - thats the bottom line. Zero interest. None of the bigger indies would either I'd wager (your One Little Indians, Dominos, Beggars Banquets, Cooking Vinyls of this world). It's all a bit Waiting For Godot this isn't it? He could if he wanted to do it himself - wouldn't be too hard - seriously. Making a record ready for 'market' ain't hard - trust me I help bands do it for a living - thats if he can be arsed to finish one. There is after the demise of Pinnacle late last year one less big indie distributor in the UK (and I'm really talking about the UK here - though Europe and the US ios pretty f**ked too).
No one - if they wanted to work with the dude would step on his toes artistically - they'd just point out the actual cost of doing stuff (manufacture, PR, ads, retail maketing etc etc) - split the costs and Bobs ya uncle. But again - this is all moot as he has no new material ready to go. So....

Best thread in a while this.... like to write moe but got to go out for dinner....sorry

Yggdrasil · 17 Jan 2009, 18:59

RobF wrote:
He's not going to be happy with any studio he can afford without record company help, even a top whack UK studio. He'll want somewhere with quality live rooms, a decent range of analogue kit, and to be frank, probably a pool too. To himself. For months.

That sure sounds like Von...

RobF wrote: Yes, I know he's not going to get it... No album. It's extremely doubtful there would still be a contractual problem with him using the name or releasing material by this point. The record company have no need for it

Its done regularly, regardless of need, and it could have happened to Eldritch. It sure looks like it has.

silentNate · 17 Jan 2009, 19:24

If I were a record company I'd be concerned about past behaviour and Eldritch's voice given recent concert reports, sorry.

dinky daisy · 17 Jan 2009, 19:58

RobF wrote:
j3 wrote:... It doesn't really cost that much to record if you are efficient with your time while doing it.

Which The Sisters never have been, especially Andrew, just look at the rest of the band's anecdotes fron VT. Literally WEEKS of vocal overdubs. \

If only he was such a perfectionist during *some* live gigs

sultan2075 · 17 Jan 2009, 21:32

silentNate wrote:If I were a record company I'd be concerned about past behaviour

There's the rub. If I were Mr. Big Time Record Mogul, I would not want to do business with Mr. E. Say what you want about his actions in the past, to a record company, he's going to seem unprofessional, unreliable, and more trouble than he's worth.

il duce · 18 Jan 2009, 13:01

And the big question is, who in their right mind would wait for a big label offer in todays climate?
Every single band is trying to get out of their contracts and Von wants to get in one, especielly after his experience with the one he had. It makes no sense at all. NIN has no contract, neither do Radiohead and R.E.M wants to get out of theirs U2 is doing theirt last album on their deal and will probably not get a new one after that. They all want to release it independently and on their own.
So, even though I have said this before, Vons talk about the money and the big record deal and all that, it is just a way for him to not have to deal with it. No one would ever offer a band touring small venues with a declining fanbase and a history of company strikes and taking for-bloody-ever to finish a album in todays climate a record deal. No one.

And one more thing.
I have read interviews with both Ben and Chris were they talk about that Sisters will never release a album as long as the recording buisness looks like it does and other rehearsed s**t. The problem with that is that it is impossible that they even believe those words themselves when both of them release album and support the buisness with their other bands. So my take is that it is the rehearsed answer Von has taught them.

Over and out.

dinky daisy · 18 Jan 2009, 13:46

So, both Ben and Chris are like the assistents to Uri Geller...

stufarq · 18 Jan 2009, 22:49

dinky daisy wrote:So, both Ben and Chris are like the assistents to Uri Geller...

Andrew is Uri geller?

Have to admit I've never seen them in the same room.

sultan2075 · 18 Jan 2009, 22:54

stufarq wrote:
dinky daisy wrote:So, both Ben and Chris are like the assistents to Uri Geller...
Andrew is Uri geller?

Have to admit I've never seen them in the same room.

So is he bending spoons when they play Snub Nose/Top Nite Out?