Lucretia

[stufarq]

...except for one thing:

Okay, in that case thanks for pushing me in some direction.

I think it still fits, though: "Let's dance the Ghost and repair the damage that the two trains are doing. And then have sex. Possibly with an 11th century philosopher."

[stufarq]

Just saw this at 1959 And All That:

"Once I built a railroad, now it's done. Buddy, can you spare a dime", American song of the 1930s depression. As an aside, 'Buddy Can You Spare A Dime?' was once piped into the Leeds DHSS offices where it was no doubt warmly received by the punters!

Also suggests that hot metal could refer to the needle for the methedrine or even a gun barrel.

I can see the logic in their idea of it being a song about the break up of the old band and the start of the new one, although I can't see "dance the ghost" as a reference to Gary Marx. And the long train must refer to the railroad rather than a wedding dress. I suppose the page on page could be the legal wranglings that held up the return of the Sisters. But the Great Depression reading of "once a railroad" doesn't sit well with this, as it would presumably mean that, having successfully built up the Sisters, Andrew was now penniless - which squares with neither this interpretation of the song nor the popular view of Jihad's "Two five zero zero zero". It does seem to fit better with the political view of the song.

[eotunun]

Somewhere someone said that initially the sunglasses mainly were a measure to avoid the employees of said DHSS recognizing the bandmembers.
In the very first days before they sold all the records they seem to have frequented offices for quite a while. So I see it possible that it's
"Once a railroad" -'Do you remember how it all started? We built it out of dirt!'
"Now it's down" -'And now they went and destroyed it all.'

Edited out some of my favourite typos. Just for *you* lot.

[stufarq]

That could work.

[eotunun]

So I read the refrain as "They chickened out, come on Patri.. erm, Lucretia, let's go on where they left and bring on the the ghost dance."
-It finally makes sense to me.

[stufarq]

Just noticed your highlighting of "Lucre". That's actually quite plausible.

[darkparticle]

stufarq you mentioned the ghost dance as refering to the Native Indian ritual and I can see this is equally as valid as refering to Marx's apre-sisters venture. Especially considering the 'circle/prophet dance' was a community dancing round an individual in the middle of the group - who then usually prophesised something in a trance state. Also the movement puts them in touch with the dead (maybe his view of the departed members of the band)

It could also be a reference to the John Norman Ghost dance novel and a not so 'welcome aboard' for Patricia. The story is about an Indian whose tradition conflicts with the culture of a white woman

...that's what I like about Eldritch lyrics, there's always multiple inflections, good poetry.

Still this doesn't answer the original Q of this thread but my hunch is that many sisters songs have whole sum meaning and are not just thoughts strung together with a rhythm

[stufarq]

Also the movement puts them in touch with the dead (maybe his view of the departed members of the band)

Ooh, I like that.

...that's what I like about Eldritch lyrics, there's always multiple inflections, good poetry.

Absolutely.

Still this doesn't answer the original Q of this thread

If a long train was held up page on page,

what would it be doing?

It's held up by page on page. If the "death of the original band and legal wranglings holding up its revival" reading is correct, then the train would be waiting for the pages to be signed off so it could get moving again.

but my hunch is that many sisters songs have whole sum meaning and are not just thoughts strung together with a rhythm

Definitely.

[eotunun]

Just noticed your highlighting of "Lucre". That's actually quite plausible.

Lucre.. That post of yours had me thinking. I didn't get beyond inverting that to Ercul and got stuck there.

[markfiend]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucre

[eotunun]

Zhiss Kraut lerrns zomzhingh new effry day here!

Edit: I apparently am great in Rincewind-style discoveries..

[stufarq]

Yes, i was thinking og money. But I really wish I'd spotted some wonderful Sisters-Poirot connection. That would be fab.

[7anthea7]

Dunno if this is relevant or not, but...

At First Ave in Minneapolis, he concluded the song with 'Once a railroad, now it's nine...teen...twenty...nine'.

That would seem to bear out at least one of the theories - or else he was just finding it topical, given the state of the economic meltdown. Which then begs the question, 'But why would he choose to make the reference in this particular song?'

FWIW, I'm not one of the party that loses a lot of sleep trying to figure out what the hell his lyrics mean. I'm happy when I can just figure out what the lyrics are these days...

[darkparticle]

Just saw this at 1959 And All That:

"Once I built a railroad, now it's done. Buddy, can you spare a dime", American song of the 1930s depression. As an aside, 'Buddy Can You Spare A Dime?' was once piped into the Leeds DHSS offices where it was no doubt warmly received by the punters!

slightly pedantic but the 1930's version has the lines:

Once I built a railroad, I made it run,
made it race against time.
Once I built a railroad; now it's done.
Brother, can you spare a dime?

As heard here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsJGagKWrds

more likely a source of influence is the film BCYSAD, starring Bing Crosby

[Debi]

i thought the "dance the ghost" bit was about the guy that left to form Ghost Dance?

[7anthea7]

i thought the "dance the ghost" bit was about the guy that left to form Ghost Dance?

In context, it's hard to say exactly how it could be 'about' him (Gary Marx, BTW) exactly. As an oblique reference, however, at which our Mr Eldritch excels, I'd just about put money on it. Which is not to say that any of the other interpretations are necessarily incorrect, as he also has a tendency to layer meanings. All his lyrics seem to be palimpsests...imnsho.

[Esoterica]

I was watching a video about TSOM’s Lucretia. The commentator went into great detail about how well the lyrics matched the music—the genius of those lyrics and the numerous elegant “hooks” in the song itself. Then suddenly, he went off on a tangent. He said that Andrew Eldritch, for all his bravado, seemed somehow fragile in those lyrics, as if some great loss or kind of “war wound” had damaged him, possibly permanently. I wonder how the commentator arrived at this conclusion. After all, TSOM’s music was supposedly considered tongue-in-cheek. Maybe he had actually met the members of TSOM at some point, who knows? It was pretty gutsy of him to put forth his views on YouTube. But then, truth is the loneliest word in the English language. And maybe the “damage done” was real.

[H. Blackrose]

He said that Andrew Eldritch, for all his bravado, seemed somehow fragile in those lyrics, as if some great loss or kind of “war wound” had damaged him, possibly permanently. I wonder how the commentator arrived at this conclusion. After all, TSOM’s music was supposedly considered tongue-in-cheek.

I think you're right.

The lyrics retain their usual oblique sub-texts, but there is a new directness of language on the surface. It has been noticed that there is no sense whatever of 'victim' on the 'Vision Thing' album (maybe because this had too often been fallaciously inferred from the overlooked ironies of previous records).