Heartland

jost 7 wrote:
If the sisters would do it, then you likely might enjoy in addition to have wayne doing it. He is part of it also.

Oh certainly. I've already said I'd jump at it

Sisters without Ravey Davey is more pertinent. He is the sisters

paint it black wrote:Sisters without Ravey Davey is more pertinent. He is the sisters

I always preferred Si Denbigh. He just got on with the job, no fuss. No taking a bow at the end....

Mav787 wrote:

paint it black wrote:Sisters without Ravey Davey is more pertinent. He is the sisters

I always preferred Si Denbigh. He just got on with the job, no fuss. No taking a bow at the end....

Bit too goth though wasn't he?

Pista wrote:

Mav787 wrote:

paint it black wrote:Sisters without Ravey Davey is more pertinent. He is the sisters

I always preferred Si Denbigh. He just got on with the job, no fuss. No taking a bow at the end....

Bit too goth though wasn't he?

Mav787 wrote: But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

Maybe for the same reason why it is obviously impossible to release a new m*****n album and do a tour without coming here,
spitting on The Sisters of Mercy as they are today compared to the of course very much better m*****n and spoiling the atmosphere.
Were it not enough to say, hey, there's a new single, album, tour?
Apparently not. At least not for once since 1985!!!

Mav787 wrote:Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

Phh, maybe because Sisters fans don't invade other bands forums to spoil their day and pleasure of the band they enjoy
and make a fuss on their platforms (in hope for a little additional profit, I guess). There is indeed anything better than doing that.
Especially lovely that you're now trying to even turn the stick around. Tsa-ha. Nothing lost.

Mav787 wrote:

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:far from being an elitist statement , when i say true fans i smply mean those of us who still love the band REGARDLESS, as opposed to those who no longer do.

You still sound elitist.

I don't think it's healthy to try to define 'true fans'. And loving a band regardless makes it sounds like a cult.

It's possible to love a band whilst not being entirely happy with things.

Elitist are those who think it fine to judge about the "healthiness" of other people's pleasures or views...
... and then complain that there are complaints, reformulate the same views they've formerly degraded
and think to ever so soflty get away with it. Congrats.

Mav787 wrote:

Pista wrote:Bottom line is, whether you liked the album or not, FALAA without Eldritch "played as it was in the day" just (IMO) seems wrong. It would have such in important component (the voice) missing. It already suffered, to a lesser degree, when Marx left &, love him or hate him, I still think Wayne really stepped up to finish that tour.

I understand your view and initially it was one that I shared.

Coming to terms with the fact that it's most unlikely AE would ever entertain WH's proposal then I'm now looking at this as:
1. A fan of FALAA
2. A fan of WH and Craig
As such I'd like to see it happen and I'm not too fussed about the choice of vocalist.

Respecting that there are people on here that may not be no.1 and are definitely not no. 2 then I can understand people not wanting to see it. After all it's an individual's prerogative to attend a gig or not.

But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

If it was a Sisters cover band in Mexico doing it then nobody would care. If you don't recognise WH as having had a positive impact on the Sisters then why get worked up about this? Ignore it and spend your time more profitably on something else.

Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

I am not a fan of that band but if some of them want to do a tour with a singer or singers of their choosing why not. It could be a highly enjoyable experience for many and in the general scheme of things it does no harm, like you said those of us who care little for that guitarists post sisters work can just think oh OK I'll give that a miss. IF it makes people happy for a brief time then good there is enough misery in this world.

Being645 wrote:

Mav787 wrote: But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

Maybe for the same reason why it is obviously impossible to release a new m*****n album and do a tour without coming here,
spitting on The Sisters of Mercy as they are today compared to the of course very much better m*****n and spoiling the atmosphere.
Were it not enough to say, hey, there's a new single, album, tour?
Apparently not. At least not for once since 1985!!!

Mav787 wrote:Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

Phh, maybe because Sisters fans don't invade other bands forums to spoil their day and pleasure of the band they enjoy
and make a fuss on their platforms (in hope for a little additional profit, I guess). There is indeed anything better than doing that.
Especially lovely that you're now trying to even turn the stick around. Tsa-ha. Nothing lost.

You won't remember but you came and sat next to me and my girlfriend on the train from Belfast to Dublin Sisters gigs a few years ago. We had a pleasant conversation for the whole 2 hour journey.

But on this forum I find your single-minded approach to all things Sisters quite offensive.

I was a Sisters fan before The m*****n existed. I continued to be a Sisters fan post-85. I was at Wembley in 1990. I've never stopped going to see them and have seen the Sisters nearly 100 times.

I post here as a Sisters fan and you don't get to judge that I'm not. It doesn't matter if I like The m*****n as well.

It's not like football teams where they are in direct competition and you choose one team to support.

Sometimes I wonder if you're determined to drive everyone off this forum who doesn't agree 100% with your one-eyed zealotry.

Being645 wrote:

Mav787 wrote: But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

Maybe for the same reason why it is obviously impossible to release a new m*****n album and do a tour without coming here,
spitting on The Sisters of Mercy as they are today compared to the of course very much better m*****n and spoiling the atmosphere.
Were it not enough to say, hey, there's a new single, album, tour?
Apparently not. At least not for once since 1985!!!

Mav787 wrote:Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

Phh, maybe because Sisters fans don't invade other bands forums to spoil their day and pleasure of the band they enjoy
and make a fuss on their platforms (in hope for a little additional profit, I guess). There is indeed anything better than doing that.
Especially lovely that you're now trying to even turn the stick around. Tsa-ha. Nothing lost.

The first reply sums up "perfectly! what is happening with the latest events
The second reply is As real as life itself.

Little can be added

Easy now everybody.
Chill.
It always causes heated debate when Hussey is mentioned or starts talking Sisters.
We're all entitled to our opinions whether they involve Huss-love or not.

Either discussing The m*****n single and Wayne's mention of touring FALAA (neither of which I started) is classed as Sisters related and BEING645 and DTSOM back off or move the threads to the General Forum where given we discuss things as inconsequential as Fantasy Football there, the threads will be tolerated.

It is Sisters related IMO Juergen.
It can stay for now...although it may get locked if people don't calm down.
It's only rock n rolll.....

The irony being that DTSOM is going to see The m*****n in Madrid tomorrow night.

Diego do you want me to get you a pass to the after show and you can tell Wayne and Craig just how s**t the FALAA-era was?

But is Von gay??

Mav787 wrote:The irony being that DTSOM is going to see The m*****n in Madrid tomorrow night.

Diego do you want me to get you a pass to the after show and you can tell Wayne and Craig just how s**t the FALAA-era was?

Look, I do not know your name it seems that you know mine.
I am a mish fan too other thing is what I think of them...
I like them when they focus on themselves ....they are a success band and I see all this unnecessary.
Who said FALAA era was s**t?? I love that era ,I have about 200 recordings and a few DVDs. Only that the past is the past(30 years)
You have your point of view and I have mine...thanks for the offer but NO. Seeing them from the stage is enough for me.
And with all my respects if I go to see them or not is not your business
You can let them know about me and say to the security do not let me in as it seems that you are friends of them.... Anything else don't hesitate to pm me..because all of this public is just as a circus

paint it black wrote:But is Von gay??

EmmaPeelWannaBe wrote:

paint it black wrote:But is Von gay??

He certainly looks to be very happy of late

He certainly looks to be very happy of late

It must be that spell we've put on him

Mav787 wrote:
You still sound elitist.

I don't think it's healthy to try to define 'true fans'. And loving a band regardless makes it sounds like a cult.

It's possible to love a band whilst not being entirely happy with things.

i wasn't trying to define "true fans". i was explaining the context in which i had used the term as some had misinterpreted/misunderstood my meaning and accused me of being elitist. ( if i was actually being elitist i would have no problem with admitting to it - i really couldn't give twofucks what other people think of me as it is: if i thought i were somehow better than them i would be happy to tell them so.)
so -substitute football teams for bands then tell me that its wrong to love something regardless. and aren't the fans who follow their team week in week out through the ups and downs true-fans as opposed to armchair supporters or fairweather supporters? (and no, music and football arent the same thing but we're talking about fandom, which is simply being "fanatical" about something.)
of course it is possible to love something and still be unhappy about it; but some people LOVE to be unhappy about it.
i wasnt saying that everyone should love the same things to the same degree either. for starters although there are some people who undoubtedly love the sisters as much as i do there are many more who obviously dont. i really couldnt give a shit either way (although i would snort derisively to myself if anyone suggested that they loved them more but thats neither here nor there...)

My point is there in black and white and is so unambiguos that its been ignored in favour of re-misinterpreting something ive explained twice:

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:those who AREN'T happy with it should either do something else instead, or save everyone -including themselves- from their pointless, endless griping which will change nothing.

the same sentiment in fact that you espouse here with regard to people moaning about the mish.

Mav787 wrote:
But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews

pot*kettle*susanne?

Mav787 wrote:

Being645 wrote:

Mav787 wrote: But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

Maybe for the same reason why it is obviously impossible to release a new m*****n album and do a tour without coming here,
spitting on The Sisters of Mercy as they are today compared to the of course very much better m*****n and spoiling the atmosphere.
Were it not enough to say, hey, there's a new single, album, tour?
Apparently not. At least not for once since 1985!!!

Mav787 wrote:Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

Phh, maybe because Sisters fans don't invade other bands forums to spoil their day and pleasure of the band they enjoy
and make a fuss on their platforms (in hope for a little additional profit, I guess). There is indeed anything better than doing that.
Especially lovely that you're now trying to even turn the stick around. Tsa-ha. Nothing lost.

You won't remember but you came and sat next to me and my girlfriend on the train from Belfast to Dublin Sisters gigs a few years ago. We had a pleasant conversation for the whole 2 hour journey.

But on this forum I find your single-minded approach to all things Sisters quite offensive.

I was a Sisters fan before The m*****n existed. I continued to be a Sisters fan post-85. I was at Wembley in 1990. I've never stopped going to see them and have seen the Sisters nearly 100 times.

I post here as a Sisters fan and you don't get to judge that I'm not. It doesn't matter if I like The m*****n as well.

It's not like football teams where they are in direct competition and you choose one team to support.

Sometimes I wonder if you're determined to drive everyone off this forum who doesn't agree 100% with your one-eyed zealotry.

Hold on Graeme, Being645 isnt judging you or attacking you personally, so why are you being like that to her? She puts a hell of a lot of her time into Heartland, into things like the wiki, for the use/pleasure of ALL heartlanders of ALL opinions.
as this is a sisters of mercy fan forum it''s odd that you could be offended or even surprised to find people here who are single-minded about the band. i agree with everythings shes said, yet you're not being downright rude to me.

Lee,

This is how I see it, rightly or wrongly:

1. Hom Corleone, as an admin, has said that both The m*****n single post and this one are Sisters related and belong in the Sisters forum.

2. Posts are interesting if criticism, both positive and negative, is constructive. Posts such as 'is this now myWasteland?' are not. If you have nothing worthwhile to add then ignore the post. I've no interest in Chris Catalyst's solo career so I'm not going to contribute to the new post on here. It's really easy to do yet seems beyond some people.

3. I picked on BEING645 because I felt she was questioning my right to post on here. It feels like to her if you're not 100% behind AE all the time then you're not worthy of this forum. And this attitude has driven people off here and onto the FB groups. Only yesterday there was an interesting post about the 1984 gig at Manchester University. Those interesting conversations don't happen on here anymore.

4. Whilst some people have posted that the Sisters are rubbish nowadays you'll not find any posts from me saying that. But I should be allowed mild disappointment occasionally.

5. To go back to the football teams analogy it's just not the same. People spending money on m*****n stuff does not stop them spending on the Sisters as well. The days of tribal fan bases ended a long, long time ago.

6 You, DTSOM, and being645 are nice people in person but something about The Sisters sometimes changes how you are on-line.

"3. I picked on BEING645" -- interesting choice of words
No one, not even those of us who like the current incarnation of the Sisters, like to have their opinions belittled. Nor do they want their real life identities outed. So we hesitate to post, to utter a pro-Eldritch sentiment, lest we get picked on.

Personally, living in the US during this election is providing me more than enough strife and bickering. It would be nice to come the HL and be around children who play nicely with each other.

And express our appreciation for the amazing Being645 and sisterswiki. I dread to think of what my work days would be like without sisterswiki.

Mav787 wrote:Lee,

This is how I see it, rightly or wrongly:

1. Hom Corleone, as an admin, has said that both The m*****n single post and this one are Sisters related and belong in the Sisters forum.

2. Posts are interesting if criticism, both positive and negative, is constructive. Posts such as 'is this now myWasteland?' are not. If you have nothing worthwhile to add then ignore the post. I've no interest in Chris Catalyst's solo career so I'm not going to contribute to the new post on here. It's really easy to do yet seems beyond some people.

3. I picked on BEING645 because I felt she was questioning my right to post on here. It feels like to her if you're not 100% behind AE all the time then you're not worthy of this forum. And this attitude has driven people off here and onto the FB groups. Only yesterday there was an interesting post about the 1984 gig at Manchester University. Those interesting conversations don't happen on here anymore.

4. Whilst some people have posted that the Sisters are rubbish nowadays you'll not find any posts from me saying that. But I should be allowed mild disappointment occasionally.

5. To go back to the football teams analogy it's just not the same. People spending money on m*****n stuff does not stop them spending on the Sisters as well. The days of tribal fan bases ended a long, long time ago.

6 You, DTSOM, and being645 are nice people in person but something about The Sisters sometimes changes how you are on-line.

1 the thread is a discussion revolving around high-profile ex-members of the band and the possibility of their performing the FALAA album live, sans eldritch, so yes of course it belongs in Sisters Chat. whether it would have stayed there under The Chairman's moderation is a different matter.

2 , ive just rereadthe whole thread; partly to make sure i hadn't missed anything and partly to see how the antagomism started, and with whom.
most of the debate herein is opinion which i'm sure we'll all agree everyone is entitled to. " which era of the sisters is the best" is always really "which era of the sisters is my favourite" and therefore an utterly ridiculous thing for fans of the band to fall out about. getting snippy with each other over personal choice should be beneath us.
Heartland threads have never been good at staying on the rails and thats not what the place is about, either in spirit or reality, so dont expect people to respect the "if youve got nothing worthwhile to say" idea. as for DTSOM's "wasteland"comment not being constructive , i dont see that it was anything other than an observation. a lot of the same tired arguments are endlessly recycled and it can get tedious here sometimes. saying that its good to see a more positive attitude existing amongst the fan base at recent concerts isnt a bad thing.

3 & 4 Being645 wasn't questioning your right to post on here. what she was expressing,, by way of answering your question, was a frustration at the way some people think its Wayne and the missions god-given right to be given kudos and spoken of as relevant and with respect here, or as you say, be ignored by those who dislike him, and yet it is perfectly ok for people to constantly be negative and derogatory about the sisters.
there is a history of m*****n fans coming here to spout on about wayne of his new record or whatever, who get miffed cause no-ones really interested or feel put out that he's not revered as some sort of god and just get abusive. add to that those people here who do NOTHING but put the sisters down. those who seem to have that as their main reason to be on Heartland. she didnt say that you were responsible and she wasnt attacking you personally or lumping you in with those people. she didnt deserve to be "picked on " for anything.

5 i dont know what you're on about with regard to spending money on different bands. that was nothing to do with ml true-fans comments . the football analogy was used only to say that how come its ok for football fans to express their fanaticism in a certain way but its not ok for music fans to? the acceptability of fan behaviour should be the same regardless of whether theyre football fans, sisters fans, or stamp-collecting fans.

6 DTSOM and Being are very nice people and i'm proud to call them friends. i'm not at all nice, but that shows youve not met me much in the real world and is neither here not there. however, i am consistantly Lee -that is exactly who i am and how i have always been. the sisters dont change how i am but they have been part of me for a long time and undoubtely helped form who i am. i just get very protective of things that i love especially my friends. and the sisters. if being defensive of the sisters is mine, sabine and diegos "crime" then dont ever slag off justin beiber on twitter cuz his fans will hunt you down.

Mav787 wrote:

Being645 wrote:

Mav787 wrote: But why don't those people just ignore it? Don't post about it, don't go to the gig, don't read the reviews, ignore any public proclamations from WH.

Maybe for the same reason why it is obviously impossible to release a new m*****n album and do a tour without coming here,
spitting on The Sisters of Mercy as they are today compared to the of course very much better m*****n and spoiling the atmosphere.
Were it not enough to say, hey, there's a new single, album, tour?
Apparently not. At least not for once since 1985!!!

Mav787 wrote:Interestingly there has been little to no discussion about this on m*****n forums on FB. They are all too busy enjoying the new album and the tour with 40+ different songs being played across the dates.

Phh, maybe because Sisters fans don't invade other bands forums to spoil their day and pleasure of the band they enjoy
and make a fuss on their platforms (in hope for a little additional profit, I guess). There is indeed anything better than doing that.
Especially lovely that you're now trying to even turn the stick around. Tsa-ha. Nothing lost.

You won't remember but you came and sat next to me and my girlfriend on the train from Belfast to Dublin Sisters gigs a few years ago. We had a pleasant conversation for the whole 2 hour journey.

Why should I not remember. It was a really lovely journey with the both of you and with the others around.
And after that (and also given all the lovely things you're doing here with that footie game in the General Chat)
I had never imagined you to behave like you're doing now. What's the matter?

Mav787 wrote:But on this forum I find your single-minded approach to all things Sisters quite offensive.

That's your problem. Check all my posts and you will find that I'm not offensive. Opinions differ like taste.

Mav787 wrote:I was a Sisters fan before The m*****n existed. I continued to be a Sisters fan post-85. I was at Wembley in 1990. I've never stopped going to see them and have seen the Sisters nearly 100 times.

OK. And what? Are you the sooper-dooper over-Sisters fan now, who's opinion is worth more than the opinion of anyone who's only seen them twice
or who is not good friends with any of their former guitarists? And you talk about "elitism" ... ... Come down, Mav787 ...

Mav787 wrote:I post here as a Sisters fan and you don't get to judge that I'm not. It doesn't matter if I like The m*****n as well.

... :?: ...
I've never ever touched on any sort of issue even only slightly that related to the question whether you (or anybody) were a Sisters fan or not!!!
That sort of low level is absolutely not my world!!!!!!! Fact is however, that m*****n activities announced here are - absolutely unnecessarily -
ALWAYS accompanied by Sisters-bashing and by attempts to humiliate those who find pleasure in the current Sisters line-up.

It might be hard to imagine, but I do have friends who like the m*****n. For sure, we won't listen together, because for me, the m*****n
are as unbearable as Europe, The Scorpions or many other bands ... ... but hell, there's other things to do together and other bands to listen to.

Mav787 wrote:It's not like football teams where they are in direct competition and you choose one team to support.

And now you want to teach me the football lesson, love? Thank you.
Btw, I think it's lovely that there are now three teams participating ... go figure!

Mav787 wrote:Sometimes I wonder if you're determined to drive everyone off this forum who doesn't agree 100% with your one-eyed zealotry.

Ah, ok. You have to jump that train as well. Sorry to see ... a very wrong impression.
For what f**king reason should I or anyone else want to drive people away from this forum
Well, there was a time, of course, when newbies were f**ked off almost on arrival if someone just loved to kick them for no reason. But that was not me!
To me, everyone is welcome here! Some time ago, I have even started a thread in the Trading Section for items referring to other bands related to
The Sisters of Mercy (and that does of course include the m*****n). Check it out! It's not my fault that no-one is interested to contribute to that thread!!!
The chance is there. "one-eyed zealotry" ... ... you have no idea, but don't worry, I'm used to way more that that.

Beyond all this one question: Why don't you refer to what I replied to your posts and keep to the issues in there?
That gives way to the impression that all you want is to silence every pleasure relating to The Sisters on this forum and draw it all to your wonderful m*****n
as they are touring now and in want for some more album sales. No new strategy, either. However, I dearly hope for the day that their album sales reach beyond
their hopes and their tour is over ... and one thing is sure - so far, I've always given their releases a chance ... that is over now. Not only because, after hundreds
of attempts, I think it's just not for me, but also because of their (and their fans') promotion strategies, which are just off-putting. And they obiously never learn.

Mav787 wrote:3. I picked on BEING645 because I felt she was questioning my right to post on here. It feels like to her if you're not 100% behind AE all the time then you're not worthy of this forum. And this attitude has driven people off here and onto the FB groups. Only yesterday there was an interesting post about the 1984 gig at Manchester University. Those interesting conversations don't happen on here anymore..

You topped yourself there. Not worthy of this forum! ... I won't buy that that is how you really feel. And then you're trying to make me the scapegoat for everything ... Mind, some people want THEIR OWN SISTERS PAGES, and so they do it. That's fully ok with me, but I won't go to the f***book. And it is THEIR DECISION to keep THEIR PAGES there CLOSED from the public, so that only f***book-obeyers can see them, quite consciously avoiding that what is written there could possibly be discussed here too, how lovely ... and all that, because not everybody here loves the m*****n? ... and because not everybody here hates The Sisters after 1985? And so they do like the m*****n have told them: burn the bridges to their Heartland home and ask their "friends" to follow, because of that bad, bad Being645?... lol ...
... and you come and talk about "elitism" and "attitude"... grow up!

Mav787 wrote:4. Whilst some people have posted that the Sisters are rubbish nowadays you'll not find any posts from me saying that. But I should be allowed mild disappointment occasionally.

You know exactly that on the Heartland Forums even the worst rants are tolerated and at the utmost met with a red print remark from the mods.
Hardly ever does anybody get banned from this place. And that's how it should be.

Mav787 wrote:Anyone who picks going to a gig of the current line up over a gig being played like on the Black October tour either never saw that tour or has Alzheimer's.

Phh ... I would never say such a thing, not even about a missionado, and yet, I just ignored that unkindliness and did not comment,
because, IMHO too, there has to be some open space to express oneself even in not so pleasant a way.
And I do enjoy to express myself in nasty ways as well from time to time.

Anyway, now that the atmospere is utterly spoilt over here, you probably got what you wanted
and everybody's leaving to the f***book pages and the wasteland forum with all the lovely
friends and people and all the interesting conversations. And above all, without the nasty Being645 ... ...

EmmaPeelWannaBe wrote: I dread to think of what my work days would be like without sisterswiki.

No worries, EmmaPeelWannaBe! The SistersWiki will always be there. As soon as I am gone, all the lovely people will return from f***book and edit ... ...

Btw, you - like everyone - can do so as well, and even now. Just request an account ...
http://sisterswiki.org/Special:RequestAccount