The Sisters of Mercy Forum
...SINsister wrote:stufarq wrote:In other news, apparently the most popular Google search yesterday was "What is the EU?"No doubt those searches originated here in the U.S...
... anyway, whatever it was, the ideas of it will change now ... 
...& one well worth having & striving to achieve.Being645 wrote: In both cases, that, apparently, was just an attempt of a dream ...
You're in Eastern Europe?sultan2075 wrote:This thread continues to be fascinating and insightful to me. Just last night (I'm visiting family in Eastern Europe) I was accosted by a group of drunken German soccer hooligans singing songs about how great the Brexit is. They're happy to see the UK go. I did not know what to think of it. Still not sure.
Vilnius - I aim to be back regularly.Pista wrote:You're in Eastern Europe?sultan2075 wrote:This thread continues to be fascinating and insightful to me. Just last night (I'm visiting family in Eastern Europe) I was accosted by a group of drunken German soccer hooligans singing songs about how great the Brexit is. They're happy to see the UK go. I did not know what to think of it. Still not sure.
Yay! Where you at?
Next time then.sultan2075 wrote:I'd love to - but we're here for one more day, then back to DC (alas - I have fallen in love with Vilnius. Perhaps unsurprising given that I fell in love with a gal from Vilnius 16 years ago. And before anyone asks, we met in a course on Plato's Laws).
Aye, we have been playing "tag" for a while, haven't we? If you're ever in Washington DC, drop me a line.Pista wrote:Next time then.sultan2075 wrote:I'd love to - but we're here for one more day, then back to DC (alas - I have fallen in love with Vilnius. Perhaps unsurprising given that I fell in love with a gal from Vilnius 16 years ago. And before anyone asks, we met in a course on Plato's Laws).
If those Europeans let me stay that is
Will do if I ever get theresultan2075 wrote:Aye, we have been playing "tag" for a while, haven't we? If you're ever in Washington DC, drop me a line.Pista wrote:Next time then.sultan2075 wrote:I'd love to - but we're here for one more day, then back to DC (alas - I have fallen in love with Vilnius. Perhaps unsurprising given that I fell in love with a gal from Vilnius 16 years ago. And before anyone asks, we met in a course on Plato's Laws).
If those Europeans let me stay that is
Many pro-EU people here in Germany seem to be relieved that what they consider a permanent troublemaker has gone. They also were not happy about the "Extrawurst" (special treatment) that Britain has been claiming for itself, like the contributions rebate. The general belief seems to be that Britain wanted to leave because they cannot dominate like they did in their empire.eastmidswhizzkid wrote:i daresay german soccer hooligans are of the same mentality as ours, and still harp on about the great rivalry (which is ancient history) between britain and germany eg 2 world wars and a world cup etc etc. maybe theyre celebrating seeing the back of any affiliation between our countries; maybe they see what a collossal disaster it is for the old enemy.
neither group sound like german soccer hooligans though do they?nowayjose wrote:Many pro-EU people here in Germany seem to be relieved that what they consider a permanent troublemaker has gone. They also were not happy about the "Extrawurst" (special treatment) that Britain has been claiming for itself, like the contributions rebate. The general belief seems to be that Britain wanted to leave because they cannot dominate like they did in their empire.eastmidswhizzkid wrote:i daresay german soccer hooligans are of the same mentality as ours, and still harp on about the great rivalry (which is ancient history) between britain and germany eg 2 world wars and a world cup etc etc. maybe theyre celebrating seeing the back of any affiliation between our countries; maybe they see what a collossal disaster it is for the old enemy.
Others, who are more pro-British, are glad about BREXIT because it damages the EU, which they are opposed to, and hope it will set a precedent for others to follow.
That's true, but that's also not true. When it was very close that PL was about to meet convergence criteria, and it was after 2008, no one here said that we have to join Euro-currency-zone. None will do that untill Eurozone will be healed. It's not an automatic procedure, it's still up to every country, but in treaty it's written that country will do join Eurozone.stufarq wrote: All new EU member states are required to join the Eurozone as soon as they meet the convergence criteria. The UK and Denmark negotiated opt-outs because they joined the EU before the Eurozone had been set up. New members don't get opt-outs, and the other EU countries that aren't currently Eurozone members will be obliged to join once they qualify. So Scotland wouldn't have to adopt the Euro straight away, but would have to commit to adopting it in future.
True, which is why I said we'd have to commit to adopting it in future.Bartek wrote:That's true, but that's also not true. When it was very close that PL was about to meet convergence criteria, and it was after 2008, no one here said that we have to join Euro-currency-zone. None will do that untill Eurozone will be healed. It's not an automatic procedure, it's still up to every country, but in treaty it's written that country will do join Eurozone.
Not to mention that countries can play it's economic and fiscal policy to not to meet that criteria.
Or what the rest of us call caring about our fellow human beings. True, there may be some abusing the system, but blanket statements writing them all off are grossly unfair. Drug, alcohol and other welfare programmes are vey important, as is helping those who've gotten themselves into trouble.Bartek wrote:UK started to had economic problems mainly because of s**t of money spent on alcoholics drug addict, lazy bimbos having 62 kids getting social benefits.
There are probably a few (just as there are some Britons), but the numbers would be negligible. I'm pretty sure all the figures show foreign nationals account for only a tiny proportion of things like benefits, NHS etc.Bartek wrote:immigrants are using - it's true to say that sometimes overuse - privilege from UK social benefit law,
I've did a bit or reading (thanks for the link) and yes I understand this. Today the First Minister was not talking about applying to be an EU member as we were already EU members, she was talking about remaining. Some EU members (French and Belgium) have written to the President stating they thought Scotland should be allowed to remain. I know there is no precedent for this and in some darkest reaches of the internet they are thinking that in this senario that Scotland could continue as the member state if there was enough support/will within the EU for this to happen. Actually some of the more sensible No supporting forums/blogs that I like to keep an eye on and a few of the more sensible Yes blogs that I follow. In that senario both sides reckon (yes they agree on something at last) that Scotland could inherit some of the UK's opt outs. There's talk of special status where we stay part of the UK and of the EU to having to use the indyref to do the job that way. Any thoughts on how that might work? Obviously the FM chose her words very carefully so she must have some kind of plan.stufarq wrote: All new EU member states are required to join the Eurozone as soon as they meet the convergence criteria. The UK and Denmark negotiated opt-outs because they joined the EU before the Eurozone had been set up. New members don't get opt-outs, and the other EU countries that aren't currently Eurozone members will be obliged to join once they qualify. So Scotland wouldn't have to adopt the Euro straight away, but would have to commit to adopting it in future.
Yeah, it seemed pretty clear she'd rather go down that path (and any others they can come up with) before trying for another independence referendum. (Not because she doesn't want independence, but because she knows there's no certainty of winning.) As you say, there's no precedent (I know they keep talking about Greenland, but I don't think it's particularly similar), and I don't know how willing thee EU would be. We'll just have to wait and see. There's always the possibility they'd make losing the opt-outs the price of getting to stay, as they'd be glad to get rid of them. Not sure what you mean about using indyref to do the job. Do you mean making it some sort of bargaining chip? I'm not sure how that would work: the UK government, who don't want independence, probably wouldn't have a say in Scotland remaining in; and the EU, who would make the decision, probably don't care much whether Scotland is independent or not. But I've probably misunderstood what you mean.Pat wrote:
I've did a bit or reading (thanks for the link) and yes I understand this. Today the First Minister was not talking about applying to be an EU member as we were already EU members, she was talking about remaining. Some EU members (French and Belgium) have written to the President stating they thought Scotland should be allowed to remain. I know there is no precedent for this and in some darkest reaches of the internet they are thinking that in this senario that Scotland could continue as the member state if there was enough support/will within the EU for this to happen. Actually some of the more sensible No supporting forums/blogs that I like to keep an eye on and a few of the more sensible Yes blogs that I follow. In that senario both sides reckon (yes they agree on something at last) that Scotland could inherit some of the UK's opt outs. There's talk of special status where we stay part of the UK and of the EU to having to use the indyref to do the job that way. Any thoughts on how that might work? Obviously the FM chose her words very carefully so she must have some kind of plan.
That's, of course, up to your government to decide that things. As almost every families in PL I hade close relative in UK, i heard stories like mentioned social benefits for alcoholics, that's why i wrote that.stufarq wrote:Or what the rest of us call caring about our fellow human beings. True, there may be some abusing the system, but blanket statements writing them all off are grossly unfair. Drug, alcohol and other welfare programmes are vey important, as is helping those who've gotten themselves into trouble.
True and not true the same, combine of econimic crisis and your social wealfare policy is a reason for your own ecomonic situation.stufarq wrote: And welfare spending isn't the reason the UK started having financial problems. It was part of a worldwide economic crash, mainly caused by banks lending money that didn't exist, and all of us happily borrowing it when we couldn't pay it back. (Huge simplification, I know, but it was a world away from welfare spending.)
And yet that card was also played.stufarq wrote:There are probably a few (just as there are some Britons), but the numbers would be negligible. I'm pretty sure all the figures show foreign nationals account for only a tiny proportion of things like benefits, NHS etc.Bartek wrote:immigrants are using - it's true to say that sometimes overuse - privilege from UK social benefit law,
Yeah in retrospect that was a bloody stupid thing to saystufarq wrote:Now you're just joining the scaremongers.markfiend wrote:Actually I'll go further: This will be remembered in the history books as the beginning of the slide to the next war in Europe.
Oh crumbsHom_Corleone wrote:So...Brexit struck it's first family related casualty yesterday - had a blazing row with my Daily Mail reading parents.
Some of things said were so inflammatory I'm finding it difficult to forgive.
