Heartland

Dark > "Our website is about our music. Neither entity is a multi-coloured orgasm of design. If I wanted to have a s**t Flash intro that wastes bandwidth,"
You can have a nicley designed page without having a s**t Flash intro...

Dark > "or a series of inconsistent colours all over the page,"
This may be how you use color but does not reflect my talent or skill

Dark > " I'd have made a MySpace or Piczo page."
I've never seen a MySpace page that wasn't ugly or cluttered or a series of inconsistent colours all over the page

Dark > "The fact is that we have no desire to win people with our "aesthetic beauty and quality
design", they should either like us for our music, or not at all. Simple as that."
That's fine I can respect that. But suppose Von in the beginning would have designed his logo with Comic Sans.
Or why didn't he just use Helvetica. Because like it or not those things count. Design is not just about aesthetic beauty
but it is the difference between a group or business looking professional.

And good luck with your music I wish you the best of success.

9while9 wrote:Dark > " I'd have made a MySpace or Piczo page."
I've never seen a MySpace page that wasn't ugly or cluttered or a series of inconsistent colours all over the page

http://myspace.com/vennuk

9while9 wrote:Dark > "The fact is that we have no desire to win people with our "aesthetic beauty and quality
design", they should either like us for our music, or not at all. Simple as that."
That's fine I can respect that. But suppose Von in the beginning would have designed his logo with Comic Sans.
Or why didn't he just use Helvetica. Because like it or not those things count. Design is not just about aesthetic beauty
but it is the difference between a group or business looking professional.

Caslon Antique on a black background is simple, effective and a far cry from the aesthetic overload of many other bands. A simple two or three colour scheme and a sparse line-art logo are arguably the height of brand recognition, since you can reproduce it on so many media irrespective of the available resolution or space. Bare bones works and The Sisters, Editors and Black Wire are great examples thereof.

Just carry on. As usual.

Motz wrote:

9while9 wrote:Dark > " I'd have made a MySpace or Piczo page."
I've never seen a MySpace page that wasn't ugly or cluttered or a series of inconsistent colours all over the page

http://myspace.com/vennuk

9while9 wrote:Dark > "The fact is that we have no desire to win people with our "aesthetic beauty and quality
design", they should either like us for our music, or not at all. Simple as that."
That's fine I can respect that. But suppose Von in the beginning would have designed his logo with Comic Sans.
Or why didn't he just use Helvetica. Because like it or not those things count. Design is not just about aesthetic beauty
but it is the difference between a group or business looking professional.

Caslon Antique on a black background is simple, effective and a far cry from the aesthetic overload of many other bands. A simple two or three colour scheme and a sparse line-art logo are arguably the height of brand recognition, since you can reproduce it on so many media irrespective of the available resolution or space. Bare bones works and The Sisters, Editors and Black Wire are great examples thereof.

Motz I really don't want to get into a critique of your MySpace page..
I could and it would just hurt your feelings and cause a war of words
that would be really a useless waste of time. I will say however that
you have kept it as clean a layout as possible and I commend you
for that..

Personally I prefer the Bauhaus approach to design but very few clients feel comfortable with a stripped
down scheme of marketing. So I end up in at least a middle ground if the client is a good one. If not they
will take my original design and just add till they have killed any hope of a decent look. The way Sisters or
Black Wire etc. handle the marketing pieces that represent them is still a conscious effort no matter how
simple it seems and sometimes do merely to the current economic circumstances that they are in.

And I wish you also the best of luck with your music career...

@ 9W9 what I have to put up with day in day out goes like this:
from the Quark XPress Forum

there's more, when I find it and no war about InDesign over QX please

James Blast wrote:@ 9W9 what I have to put up with day in day out goes like this:
from the Quark XPress Forum

there's more, when I find it and no war about InDesign over QX please

You don't use InDesign!!!

That thread is funny as hell!!!

I'm a QX man, allas will be, now let's fall out over Illustraitor an FreeHand

<aside> I really should stick comments in my php code. But bad habits are so hard to break. I'm already looking through my files and thinking "what the fnck does this do?" </aside>

9while9 wrote:If not they will take my original design and just add till they have killed any hope of a decent look.

That's a favourite of mine too. What my boss calls "maximising use of shop-window space", I call "cluttered, messy and overloaded".

markfiend wrote: That's a favourite of mine too. What my boss calls "maximising use of shop-window space", I call "cluttered, messy and overloaded".

Pity Me It's getting better but its like banging your head against a brick wall, except without the fun.

NB I once found a mate of mine in some small amount of post girly distress, drowning his sorrows in the Phono, repeatedly headbutting the wall. When I asked him why he was doing it he calmly replied that it was because it felt so good when he stopped.

in response to the original question: we're a right bunch of snobs ain't we?

basically, when designing your first homepage just do whatever is required to get the job done, be it in frontpage, dreamweaver or notepad!

you dont work for a top design studio and your site isnt going to get a million hits per day, so if it means you get a simple web page done by the end of the week (and are still interested!!) rather than spending 2 months getting your head around all that s**t we've just talked about (and end up thoroughly f**ked off with the whole thing), then so be it.

do the simple stuff enough times and you'll get a feel for the bigger picture, and you'll start to see how it all hangs together.

then, when you've got a bit of experience under your belt, go and hang around some of the html and web designers' blogs, forums and newsgroups, and then ask us again...

Quiff Boy wrote:in response to the original question: we're a right bunch of snobs ain't we?

You mean you haven't got a n-tier, clustered, full failover architecture at home?

Bunch of amateurs

mik wrote:

Quiff Boy wrote:in response to the original question: we're a right bunch of snobs ain't we?

You mean you haven't got a n-tier, clustered, full failover architecture at home?

Bunch of amateurs

weeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllll, yes. ok. i have.



but even thats still not as impressive as the architecture we have at work.

15 load balanced windows 2003 servers proxing http requests on to a bank of about 20 bea weblogic application servers, which in turn talk via jdbc to a cluster of oracle v10 servers

Quiff Boy wrote:

mik wrote:

Quiff Boy wrote:in response to the original question: we're a right bunch of snobs ain't we?

You mean you haven't got a n-tier, clustered, full failover architecture at home?

Bunch of amateurs

weeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllll, yes. ok. i have.



but even thats still not as impressive as the architecture we have at work.

15 load balanced windows 2003 servers proxing http requests on to a bank of about 20 bea weblogic application servers, which in turn talk via jdbc to a cluster of oracle v10 servers

Home: me too
Work: Hope you've got some decent security boxes and load balancing in front of those targets; sorry I mean Win2k3 web servers.

20 instances or 20 bits of tin? What do you know about BEA Weblogic clustering, specifically multicast traffic overloading? and you're not by any chance using a hosting company in Leeds are you

while i'm here, both quiffy and mik owe me articles. consider yourselves on my hitlist. no security will save you from naked Darkness photos.

hosting is all in house. down at birstal i gather. near ikea

load balancing is done via a couple of alteon boxes. and the win 2k3 servers will be replaced with stripped down apache/tomcat proxies at some point.

i personally know little about weblogic clustering. i'm more on the "weblogic portal" side of stuff.

QB just ignored you ems

i'm fully aware of that...

James Blast wrote:QB just ignored you ems

Hammer Time!

sorry, but had to resurrect this thread after finding this:



from webpagesthatsuck.com:

Whenever there's a site that makes you wonder whether Jesus died in vain, the odds are it was created by Microsoft's (Af)FrontPage.

The Daily Sucker has featured a number of these "Car Wrecks on the Information Highway" sites. Sites like The Enchanted Harp, Stillwater Players, and The Northbridge Police Department.

The worst part of FrontPage is when someone uses those evil, ugly, and Satanic Microsoft Themes.

Maybe that explains why Microsoft doesn't use FrontPage to create pages on Microsoft.com -- even the pages discussing FrontPage. If Microsoft doesn't use it, why should you?

lazarus corporation wrote:sorry, but had to resurrect this thread after finding this:



from webpagesthatsuck.com:

Whenever there's a site that makes you wonder whether Jesus died in vain, the odds are it was created by Microsoft's (Af)FrontPage.

The Daily Sucker has featured a number of these "Car Wrecks on the Information Highway" sites. Sites like The Enchanted Harp, Stillwater Players, and The Northbridge Police Department.

The worst part of FrontPage is when someone uses those evil, ugly, and Satanic Microsoft Themes.

Maybe that explains why Microsoft doesn't use FrontPage to create pages on Microsoft.com -- even the pages discussing FrontPage. If Microsoft doesn't use it, why should you?

"I'm amazed by the number of sites with ugly graphics"

This site is a must read!!!