Heartland

Wild Bill wrote

Why the f**k was anyone interested in Guns and roses' naff,old-hat,sub Spinal tap rubbish?

Because for a brief spell they had some great tunes and were an almighty kick up the arse for rock / metal . A kick which no one, arguably, has replicated since, we await the next genre shakin' band in desperation..


You could also argue that it was Guns and Roses (who IMHO expired on release of the Illusion albums) that gave the much needed boot to Aerosmith and made them raise their game to produce the almighty, Permanent Vacation.
Alright Vacation and Appetite came out the same month, but I'm sure even if Tyler and Perry didn't know about Gn R, Desmond Child and Jim Vallance did.
Anyway, sorry it's an essay
G n R were the American Sex Pistiols for 2 years then it all went horribly wrong......(much like the sex Pistols really, in fact there are some interesting parrallels blah , blah, blah.......)

James Blast wrote:Poor man's Aerosmith with a whiney brat screaming.

Next!

Such a way with words Brother Blast, as per

DerekR wrote:

James Blast wrote:Poor man's Aerosmith with a whiney brat screaming.

Next!

Such a way with words Brother Blast, as per

Appetite For Destruction was a great Record though.

scotty wrote:

DerekR wrote:

James Blast wrote:Poor man's Aerosmith with a whiney brat screaming.

Next!

Such a way with words Brother Blast, as per

Appetite For Destruction was a great Record though.

It was indeed, but there was so much $hite afterwards that took the polish off the band and its legacy

Meh, G'n'R had about 3 good songs, give me these boys anyday...



I mean really, give me them!

(Well, Mike Monroe at least . And OK, they had even less than 3 good songs, but Axl and co. did royally rip them off)

scotty wrote:

DerekR wrote:

James Blast wrote:Poor man's Aerosmith with a whiney brat screaming.

Next!

Such a way with words Brother Blast, as per

Appetite For Destruction was a great Record though.

Says he who doesn't like Vision Thing...

undertow wrote:
G n R were the American Sex Pistiols for 2 years then it all went horribly wrong......(much like the sex Pistols really, in fact there are some interesting parrallels blah , blah, blah.......)

Now I know everyone's got their own musical preferences,one man's meat and all that.But comparing Guns 'n' roses to The Sex pistols is the equivilent of the stupid nobs that in the 70's were proclaiming The Bay city rollers as the new Beatles.
The Sex pistols (Willingly or unwillingly depending on who you believe) influenced an entire subversive counter culture, not just musically but in art,literature, fashion and lifestyle.The impact of which can still be felt some 30 years on today.
Guns 'n' roses made some records that appealed to both rock and pop fans at the fag end of a dying commercial rock era.The most subversive thing they did was to inject brown into their stupid American veins.

mh wrote:

scotty wrote:

DerekR wrote: Such a way with words Brother Blast, as per

Appetite For Destruction was a great Record though.

Says he who doesn't like Vision Thing...

Ahahaha yes, well spotted! What gives, Keef?

Keith thinks The Almichty are a proper rock band too.

boudicca wrote:Meh, G'n'R had about 3 good songs, give me these boys anyday...



I mean really, give me them!

(Well, Mike Monroe at least . And OK, they had even less than 3 good songs, but Axl and co. did royally rip them off)

Good call Claire. Can't agree about the less than 3 decent songs bit though, they released many classic albums.

The years have been...er less than kind to Mr Monroe however

He looks like the mad auntie that ye don't talk about.

Andy McCoy's looking ok though, incredibly

I remember long ago and far away having a rant about Waxl and co which ended (tongue firmly in cheek) with "Did Kurt Cobain die for nothing?"

Especially in light of what's going on, how Courtney Love is squandering his legacy, not to mention the current state of music, I'd have to reply with a resounding 'Yes, he did!'

Ahráyeph wrote:I'm all for giving a band with a new member (or several) a chance, but often enough it turns out that it's not necessarily beneficial to the band (Iron Maiden without Bruce, anyone?).

Iron Maiden without Paul, anyone?

(I won't even go into how I actually like the Bayley albums...)

Iron Midden sans Dicklessone would be a better beast.

James Blast wrote:Iron Midden sans Dicklessone would be a better beast.

I liked Maiden with Blaze!

Wild Bill wrote

....the stupid nobs that in the 70's were proclaiming The Bay city rollers as the new Beatles

.


I do, in fact know someone who would entirely agree with this appraisal of the Rollers.(Probably the hardest and most Rock n Roll 'boyband ' ever.)

As for the Pistols influencing an entire subversive counter culture.
I’d say that they lit the fuse and after that their influence was minimal.
It was everyone else who came after who created the counter culture, those that took advantage of the zeitgeist, Buzzcocks, Banshees , Magazine, Slits, X-Ray Spex, Don Letts, Skids, etc, etc
Apart from opening the floodgates (for which McClaren,(love him or loathe him) and Vivienne Westwood should get a lot of credit) no mean feat in itself., I don’t think they have left any direct influence themselves apart from the stupid, stupid, cult of Sid.
PIL is Lydon’s legacy and much more subversive than the Pistols.
Any subversion that Punk may have brought disappeared as soon as Joe Strummer started banging on about wanting his own White Riot and you started getting hassled by crazy coloured Mohawks in Carnaby Street on a Saturday afternoon, ‘for 10p mate’.

The Pistols were a pub rock band with a fine tunesmith (Matlock) who happened to get lucky timing wise and also by finding a fantastically twisted and intelligent frontman. Unfortunately they spoilt it all and popped their aura by getting back together.

I agree that the punk effect can still be felt 'in art literature and fashion today' and the world is a better place for it.
But I still think the Pistols were the powder keg that started a chain reaction, opened the doors for people yes, but it was those who ran through the doors with them that built and directed the legacy, not the Pistols as a band.

So really much the same as Guns and Roses, Appetite was a cherry bomb amongst the hairspray, shook up the US rock scene and others took up the baton whilst G n R fought each other in the playground and lost the plot..

Never Mind The Bollocks and Appetite for Destruction, great albums, great tunes ….

But really a case of, Release the pin , blow the doors and let’s sod off down the pub whilst the others do the real work…………

( Anyway, really it was Queen who invented punk, now if they hadn’t cancelled their ‘Bill Grundy’ appearance……………..)

DerekR wrote:The years have been...er less than kind to Mr Monroe however

Oh, don't Derek. I'm still not over the Peter Murphy Man-Boobs fiasco!

Does that long haired Chihuahua bite?

I hope so!

undertow wrote:
As for the Pistols influencing an entire subversive counter culture.
I’d say that they lit the fuse and after that their influence was minimal.
It was everyone else who came after who created the counter culture, those that took advantage of the zeitgeist, Buzzcocks, Banshees , Magazine, Slits, X-Ray Spex, Don Letts, Skids, etc, etc
Apart from opening the floodgates (for which McClaren,(love him or loathe him) and Vivienne Westwood should get a lot of credit) no mean feat in itself., I don’t think they have left any direct influence themselves apart from the stupid, stupid, cult of Sid.
PIL is Lydon’s legacy and much more subversive than the Pistols.

Every band mentioned there were directly influenced by The sex pistols.McClaren and Westward would still be running retro clothes shops without The Pistols.

Any subversion that Punk may have brought disappeared as soon as Joe Strummer started banging on about wanting his own White Riot and you started getting hassled by crazy coloured Mohawks in Carnaby Street on a Saturday afternoon, ‘for 10p mate’.

Obviously your not familiar with the 80's "class war" movement,my friend.

So really much the same as Guns and Roses, Appetite was a cherry bomb amongst the hairspray, shook up the US rock scene and others took up the baton whilst G n R fought each other in the playground and lost the plot..

More like suffered a huge kick up the arse by a certain Sex pistols influrenced Seattle based band

There are so many bands who released what could easily be considered "punk" before the Sex Pistols were even out of primary school.

I don't like them, FWIW.

Dark wrote:There are so many bands who released what could easily be considered "punk" before the Sex Pistols were even out of primary school.

But none of them had as much immediate impact as the Pistols did. Not only because they made good songs (they did), but also because McLaren was a brilliant media manipulator.
Johnny Rotten knows a thing or two about how to create a buzz too. Remember that Filthy Lucre thingy ?

Even though G'n'R did release one good album, I still believe they represent everything 77 punk stood against : untouchable, egomaniac rockstars, epic piano ballads, Tap-esque solos...

We could argue on and on about what punk stands for, but whatever it is, it's not the Roses.

Wild Bill wrote

Every band mentioned there were directly influenced by The sex pistols.McClaren and Westward would still be running retro clothes shops without The Pistols.

Who says? Inspired and influenced are very different things, anyway If there hadn't been a Mc Claren / Westwood , there as sure as hell wouldn't have been a Pistols



Wild Bill wrote

Obviously your not familiar with the 80's "class war" movement,my friend

.

No one gave a flying about the Pistols apart from some lorry driver and right wing tabloids. CRASS was whom everyone feared and they were nought to do with the Pistols 'Anarchy'.
Class war was nothing to do with PUNK and everything to do with CRASS and their off shoots.
Although there may have been a lot of 'punks ' wandering around Trafalgar Square chucking some stones thinking they were anarchists, it wasn't them, it was the Crass collective who were being radical.

More like suffered a huge kick up the arse by a certain Sex pistols influrenced Seattle based band

Another self obsessed 'leader of a generation' who took the easy way out and left his poor kid to face a life of goodness knows what. At least she seems to have her head screwed on right at present.

But I suppose he could write a tune and had some musicians around him to transfer it potently, but..........

Again we are at the nice tune, shame about the end result situation.

Dying young through drugs is s**t , where's the greatness in that?