Andy K's footage shows that moment from another angle at around the 2:50 mark. It's still relatively obscured but I would say that if nothing else, it challenges the idea that he "visibly stopped" singing.
I think it's a confluence of factors, folks. It's hard to claim that with perfect acoustics and mixing that he'd be delivering a pitch-perfect recreation of the recorded version (not that he's ever aspired to that), but it's equally hard to claim that better mixing and acoustics would have revealed him to either be lip-syncing or so irredeemably terrible that you wouldn't also have to call the last decade or so terrible.
With condolences to everyone who had a bad time at this first gig, I've not written off the tour yet, I think you might have just had a few factors working against your experience. There's reasons to remain optimistic. But ask me again at the end. Ha.
Andy K's footage shows that moment from another angle at around the 2:50 mark. It's still relatively obscured but I would say that if nothing else, it challenges the idea that he "visibly stopped" singing.
I think it's a confluence of factors, folks. It's hard to claim that with perfect acoustics and mixing that he'd be delivering a pitch-perfect recreation of the recorded version (not that he's ever aspired to that), but it's equally hard to claim that better mixing and acoustics would have revealed him to either be lip-syncing or so irredeemably terrible that you wouldn't also have to call the last decade or so terrible.
With condolences to everyone who had a bad time at this first gig, I've not written off the tour yet, I think you might have just had a few factors working against your experience. There's reasons to remain optimistic. But ask me again at the end. Ha.
It sure looks like he's not moving his lips to "give me siren child and do you hear me call" in the video I linked. I guess more gigs will show if the low lead vocal mix was contextual or intentional. But, to reiterate, I have no problem with Andrew using a backing track for his vocals, it's the possibility that he's recorded them that's interesting.
Ian1971 wrote: ↑12 May 2023, 17:56
I saw a fan made video of one of the US gigs this week and it sure looked liked Von was singing with the aid of a backing track - there was a moment when he visibly stopped singing and the vocal continued.....now, that doesn't bother me in the slightest but what's interesting is that it could mean he's recorded the vocals for the songs being played on this tour....
Andy K's footage shows that moment from another angle at around the 2:50 mark. It's still relatively obscured but I would say that if nothing else, it challenges the idea that he "visibly stopped" singing.
I think it's a confluence of factors, folks. It's hard to claim that with perfect acoustics and mixing that he'd be delivering a pitch-perfect recreation of the recorded version (not that he's ever aspired to that), but it's equally hard to claim that better mixing and acoustics would have revealed him to either be lip-syncing or so irredeemably terrible that you wouldn't also have to call the last decade or so terrible.
With condolences to everyone who had a bad time at this first gig, I've not written off the tour yet, I think you might have just had a few factors working against your experience. There's reasons to remain optimistic. But ask me again at the end. Ha.
It sure looks like he's not moving his lips to "give me siren child and do you hear me call" in the video I linked. I guess more gigs will show if the low lead vocal mix was contextual or intentional. But, to reiterate, I have no problem with Andrew using a backing track for his vocals, it's the possibility that he's recorded them that's interesting.
There's more going on here than one or two debatable moments. The version of 'On The Beach' from that gig is 95 per cent backing track/ mystery extra vocalist, and 'When I'm On Fire' also features significant non-Von contributions. I wonder if has/ had throat problems or something along those lines? viewtopic.php?f=2&t=28961&p=710497#p710497
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 13 May 2023, 14:09
by Fallon
Sorry, what mystery extra vocalist? That's Ben doing the baritone in On The Beach when Andrew is absent.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 13 May 2023, 14:15
by FinnMacCool
Fallon wrote: ↑13 May 2023, 14:09
Sorry, what mystery extra vocalist? That's Ben doing the baritone in On The Beach when Andrew is absent.
Okay, so it's Ben: but al the way through? Why does Andrew barely sing on this version? That's all I was asking
Fallon wrote: ↑13 May 2023, 14:09
Sorry, what mystery extra vocalist? That's Ben doing the baritone in On The Beach when Andrew is absent.
Okay, so it's Ben: but al the way through? Why does Andrew barely sing on this version? That's all I was asking
Yeah, I was at the show. Ben and Dylan both did a lot of singing, but especially Ben. Von was also singing, and could be heard perfectly fine in the beginning and on quieter songs like Something Fast. But his vocal was not turned up loudly enough. There were points where if one really strained the attention, he could be picked out of the mix, but overall his vocal was smothered by everything else. It was there, but... like a whispered word next to a jet engine.
Definitely not a pre-recorded backing track though.
As for On the Beach specifically, the most plausible theory is that he had to exit the venue for a smoke break (because it's Maryland) and that's why he wasn't on stage for most of the song.
Fallon wrote: ↑13 May 2023, 14:09
Sorry, what mystery extra vocalist? That's Ben doing the baritone in On The Beach when Andrew is absent.
Okay, so it's Ben: but al the way through? Why does Andrew barely sing on this version? That's all I was asking
Yeah, I was at the show. Ben and Dylan both did a lot of singing, but especially Ben. Von was also singing, and could be heard perfectly fine in the beginning and on quieter songs like Something Fast. But his vocal was not turned up loudly enough. There were points where if one really strained the attention, he could be picked out of the mix, but overall his vocal was smothered by everything else. It was there, but... like a whispered word next to a jet engine.
Definitely not a pre-recorded backing track though.
As for On the Beach specifically, the most plausible theory is that he had to exit the venue for a smoke break (because it's Maryland) and that's why he wasn't on stage for most of the song.
Thanks for shedding light - that all makes sense! I guess we can only speculate as to why Von was turned down so low in the mix
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 13 May 2023, 15:18
by sultan2075
Historically, it's always been a challenge, because he tends to sing on the quiet side, and if the volume is raised too much his mic feeds back.
Fallon wrote: ↑13 May 2023, 14:09
Sorry, what mystery extra vocalist? That's Ben doing the baritone in On The Beach when Andrew is absent.
Okay, so it's Ben: but al the way through? Why does Andrew barely sing on this version? That's all I was asking
Yeah, I was at the show. Ben and Dylan both did a lot of singing, but especially Ben. Von was also singing, and could be heard perfectly fine in the beginning and on quieter songs like Something Fast. But his vocal was not turned up loudly enough. There were points where if one really strained the attention, he could be picked out of the mix, but overall his vocal was smothered by everything else. It was there, but... like a whispered word next to a jet engine.
Definitely not a pre-recorded backing track though.
As for On the Beach specifically, the most plausible theory is that he had to exit the venue for a smoke break (because it's Maryland) and that's why he wasn't on stage for most of the song.
Maybe at the moment I flagged, it was Dylan's baritone that can be heard when Von stops singing. I was hoping Von had recorded his vocals though, for potential future studio use.
Okay, so it's Ben: but al the way through? Why does Andrew barely sing on this version? That's all I was asking
Yeah, I was at the show. Ben and Dylan both did a lot of singing, but especially Ben. Von was also singing, and could be heard perfectly fine in the beginning and on quieter songs like Something Fast. But his vocal was not turned up loudly enough. There were points where if one really strained the attention, he could be picked out of the mix, but overall his vocal was smothered by everything else. It was there, but... like a whispered word next to a jet engine.
Definitely not a pre-recorded backing track though.
As for On the Beach specifically, the most plausible theory is that he had to exit the venue for a smoke break (because it's Maryland) and that's why he wasn't on stage for most of the song.
Maybe at the moment I flagged, it was Dylan's baritone that can be heard when Von stops singing. I was hoping Von had recorded his vocals though, for potential future studio use.
That would have been interesting
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 14 May 2023, 09:20
by LyanvisAberrant
IIRC, At the 2019 roundhouse gigs, there was some noticable overdub in vision thing, if you're looking for some pre-recorded Von vox live. The impression that i get is it's simply for sprinklings of flavour and intensity.
And if what he says is true, they've got a fair bit recorded, just don't have any plans on doing anything with it.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 28 May 2023, 20:01
by lilac
The new songs sound really stellar on the May 23 recording, like they're the highlight of the whole set for me now
I'm not sure but I kinda feel like there aren't prerecorded Andrew vocals just because he sings/forgets every song in so many different ways every time, that wouldn't happen if it was tape right? Ben seems to sing along almost all the time though including lower voice parts
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 29 May 2023, 08:52
by LyanvisAberrant
lilac wrote: ↑28 May 2023, 20:01
The new songs sound really stellar on the May 23 recording, like they're the highlight of the whole set for me now
I'm not sure but I kinda feel like there aren't prerecorded Andrew vocals just because he sings/forgets every song in so many different ways every time, that wouldn't happen if it was tape right? Ben seems to sing along almost all the time though including lower voice parts
Also some very good points!
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 18 Jun 2023, 15:31
by Erudite
Does anyone know if the third verse of On The Beach, as listed on the official site, has actually been performed live?
Or, given its uncharacteristic clunkiness, has quality control weeded it out?
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 29 Aug 2023, 02:08
by Esoterica
Erudite, I think quality control weeded it out.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 27 Sep 2023, 11:10
by g44fr
With Dylan departure, I guess this is the end of new new new song’s revelation. Pity
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 02 Oct 2023, 19:40
by Nyth Grandbeard
g44fr wrote: ↑27 Sep 2023, 11:10
With Dylan departure, I guess this is the end of new new new song’s revelation. Pity
As if it wasn't already unlikely, I feel like the chances of these new songs making their way into the studio must have dropped even more since Dylan has writing credits on these new songs. I mean I know they've released tracks with former band mates having writing credits (like Ben Gunn, or the Mish crew.) but as if Eldritch couldn't be motivated to record the new songs before, I feel like he would certainly feel even less motivated now.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 02 Oct 2023, 21:40
by Bartek
Was that even a slim chance that these songs could have been recorded?
I mean, technicly speaking they may done that, but nothing more than demo or raw material.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 03 Oct 2023, 02:20
by ribbons69
Bartek wrote: ↑02 Oct 2023, 21:40
Was that even a slim chance that these songs could have been recorded?
I mean, technicly speaking they may done that, but nothing more than demo or raw material.
Personally I doubt it. Dylan leaving or staying has no bearing on why Von doesn't want to make a record.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 03 Oct 2023, 07:57
by Bartek
Exactly!
We are talking here about possibility of chance that something like this is theoretically possible, yet all lays in the hand of the Stoned Immaculate.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 03 Oct 2023, 10:16
by TheGoodSon
I do however suspect/believe that part of the behind-the-scenes drama leading up to Dylans departure had to do with him being frustrated that the new songs never seemed to get recorded. When I interviewed him (and Band and Dave) in 2019, he was very open with his view that the next logical step was to get these songs recorded. When I met him again last year, his parting words were "next time we´ll bring an album!"
Add to that that Chris has said in interviews that when he joined the band, he was led to believe (by Von) that new songs would be recorded and released.
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 03 Oct 2023, 10:18
by TheGoodSon
*(and BEN and Dave)
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 03 Oct 2023, 19:06
by Esoterica
Perhaps the reason that new songs don’t get recorded is a combination of past troubles with record labels and also voice (vocal cord) issues?
Re: NEW SONGS!
Posted: 04 Oct 2023, 10:28
by LyanvisAberrant
Esoterica wrote: ↑03 Oct 2023, 19:06
Perhaps the reason that new songs don’t get recorded is a combination of past troubles with record labels and also voice (vocal cord) issues?
And sharing writing credits, and the music industry, and releasing an album into this industry climate, and the schedules of the band members, and Vons cats need to be fed by 8pm, and the phase of the moon and stars and everything in between. We get an album when Von feels like making one.
has/ had throat problems or something along those lines? 
