Heartland

Just coming through on Sky news. Looks like Musharraf got the bullseye this time.

I normally ignore politics and world affairs as often as I can (:P ), but I'm beside myself with rage and actually really, really upset over this. Monstrous. Every passing day leaves me with less hope for the future and for humanity...

Bad, bad news!

May she rest in peace.

And, @The Ommm!: I wouldn't point my finger at Musharraf right away. They object to female domination there for religious and traditional reasons. The growing impact of radical muslims in pakistan may have to do with it as well. Two equally likely suspects. ..Two buttocks of the same arse, one might think as well. I always had the impression that Musharraf's friendlyness with the USA mainly is a hug to someone who is too strong for him to defeat.
..I may be wrong, though.

eotunun wrote:May she rest in peace.

And, @The Ommm!: I wouldn't point my finger at Musharraf right away. They object to female domination there for religious and traditional reasons. The growing impact of radical muslims in pakistan may have to do with it as well. Two equally likely suspects. ..Two buttocks of the same arse, one might think as well. I always had the impression that Musharraf's friendlyness with the USA mainly is a hug to someone who is too strong for him to defeat.
..I may be wrong, though.

Good points all round. I agree - he may not have had any implicit involvement but I can see him rubbing his hands.
There will be mayhem over there tonight.

I fear you are are right there...

The human race is de-evolving; some parts of the world have never left the Dark Ages, obviously. "Killing in the name of," indeed. Hateful.

I guess you are right there-But the drop won't be deep.

Testosterone + religion + ignorance = the root of all "evil." Alas.

I fear the sh1t will really hit the fan now

I'm missing something here.While any loss of life is regretable was she more of a loss than the 15 other people who died in the attack or the 130 who died in another attempt on her life a few months back?.
Hadn't she held office before but been dismissed due to allegations of corruption (twice)?.

Pat wrote:I'm missing something here.While any loss of life is regretable was she more of a loss than the 15 other people who died in the attack or the 130 who died in another attempt on her life a few months back?.
Hadn't she held office before but been dismissed due to allegations of corruption (twice)?.

Oooh, now there's an interesting twist.
Very well spotted there Pat.

Still, the whole thing is very fishy really & I reckon that's a country that is on the brink of a civil uprising/war or whatever you want to call it.
It wasn't far off a few weeks back, but to coin a phrase "I prophecy disaster"

Pista wrote:

Pat wrote:I'm missing something here.While any loss of life is regretable was she more of a loss than the 15 other people who died in the attack or the 130 who died in another attempt on her life a few months back?.
Hadn't she held office before but been dismissed due to allegations of corruption (twice)?.

Oooh, now there's an interesting twist.
Very well spotted there Pat.

Still, the whole thing is very fishy really & I reckon that's a country that is on the brink of a civil uprising/war or whatever you want to call it.
It wasn't far off a few weeks back, but to coin a phrase "I prophecy disaster"

I think thats the main factor here. Not the individual loss (although obviously sad) but the cultural implications.

SINsister wrote:Testosterone + religion + ignorance = the root of all "evil." Alas.

I really have to object to the implication (if it is being implied) that the "evil" and folly humanity is capable of is to do with Men, rather than People. Especially in this particular case, I don't think that has anything to do with it. OK granted, men have done most of the Big Killing throughout recorded history, but I suspect that has a great deal more to with the way our societies have been structured, how the different genders are raised, than some innate moral upper hand that we have over them. And women are as responsible for that as anyone

Back on topic - she may not have been a saint by any means (if those allegations were true), but I think she could have been a positive influence in power. I do think she was an extremely brave woman to put herself in that kind of danger for the sake of what she believed in, that's always worthy of respect. Above all it seems whoever has killed her has shot themselves in the foot, surely this will only raise the popularity of her party?

I think it is terribly sad that a country can immerse itself in violence amidst the search for peace. The people of Pakistan will suffer far longer than the political parties if war does errupt, and it will be many years before they know stability.

I work with a large number of these lovely people regularly, and in my own experience they are gentle, generous and welcoming folk. Image the hardships on thier families this violent act may trigger.... so sad.

...another chance to get Pakistan democratic lost....
...very sad hearing things like this, but i think it was more the expected...considerating the enmity that Musharraf shown her when she got back

I knew her death was inevitable from the moment I heard of her. She was nothing but a political tool, as indicated by the support of the UK, US and western media in the last few months (how many westerners had even heard of her beforehand?), used to provoke extremists. Now the US and UK has some more propaganda, because everyone's getting tired of their repetitive use of the last martyr of democracy to justify all their actions.

Pat wrote:Hadn't she held office before but been dismissed due to allegations of corruption (twice)?.

Yes, but all politicians are corrupt.

nick the stripper wrote:Yes, but all politicians are corrupt.

While there is a kernel of truth to this statement, it is nevertheless an oversimplification.

nick the stripper wrote:...(how many westerners had even heard of her beforehand?)...

I had, actually; I remembered her from her first stint in office.

From the Yahoo! News article:


"I think by far the most likely (suspect) is the al-Qaida organization, which has been trying to kill Bhutto for the better part of the decade," said Bruce Riedel, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and former senior director for South Asia on the National Security Council.

"If it's not them, it's certainly one of the groups that are sympathetic with them," Riedel said. "They all work together and share a common antipathy to Bhutto because she's a woman, an advocate of secularism, a supporter of democracy and everything they stand against."

...

In an interview with the AP in November, a former district leader of Hezb-ul Mujahedeen said some members of Pakistan's intelligence establishment resented the idea of a woman leading a Muslim nation, as well as Bhutto's denunciation of militant Muslims. Hezb-ul Mujahedeen is believed to be heavily funded by Pakistani intelligence to fight in Indian-controlled Kashmir.

"In the Pakistani (secret) agencies and in the army there are so many people who are not secular, who are fundamentalists and will help a suicide bomber to carry out his job," said the former district leader, Saifullah, who uses just one name.

These days al-Qaida is linked to almost every terror attack.
Too easy....

@ Sinnie it looks like an alibi
@ Oz....agree

Ozpat wrote:These days al-Qaida is linked to almost every terror attack.
Too easy....

Truth be known it was prolly GW.
Couldn't really see Bhutto being a willing ally to him.