Heartland

an explanation for the gig volume or lack thereof? i presume this problem must be ongoing.

the official site wrote:Even now, we have to choose between being loud (and my vocal sounding horrible) or being quiet (and my vocal sounding like it should). The problem is not feedback onstage - it's feedback between the microphone and the main PA speakers when the high end is boosted sufficiently to convey the nuance and intended perceived pitch of the vocal. At the moment we're pursuing the quieter-but-better policy. I was getting too tired of having a boomy and muddy vocal which I couldn't hear above the guitars anyway. The overall live experience might have been more powerful, but the me part of it it wasn't quite me.

No offence to Big Pete the mixing engineer: it's my fault for not being able to sing as loudly as anybody else.

I thought that this "main cause" was well-known, but the thing is, I have experienced VERY different volume just on this European leg of the tour. I almost always stand at the same spot at concerts, something like 3-8 rows in front of "between Ben and Andrew" which sometimes means the moshpit, sometimes not.

I found the volume in Tienen, Chicago, Brussels and Berlin perfect, but later on, in Stockholm and Leeds it was way too low, at least in the beginning of the concerts. I have never expected or wanted Motorhead levels, but I expect for example the Afterhours intro to be booming and not whispering, and I don't expect being able to talk with a normal voice level during Crash&Burn.

I'm afraid the only plausible connection between the main cause and the difference between concerts I talk about is that Andrew sings even lower after they have been touring for a while.

Maybe the only solution that really works is shortening the tours? I'd find a maximum of 15-20 concerts good for each tour leg, and I think the general atmosphere would benefit as well.

i should imagine that the difference between venues is a variety of offences, from the use -or not- of venue pa, through the general acoustics (and therefore the levels at soundcheck when the place is empty), to the "allowed" volume of said venue. this isn't me excusing the band from any blame BTW, it's just something i've noticed applying to many acts in many of the same venues (as i've seen the sisters play recently) over the years. motorhead, for example, have never been as loud as the times i've seen them play demontfort hall in leicester and never as quiet as in the NIA (where the management had the nerve to order the sound turned down) or rock city which is consistantly in the middle (and for the many, many bands i've seen there.)

i was just bringing attention to an existing official band policy which i hadn't been previously aware of, for those others of us who may not have trawled the technical sections of the official site recently. for those of you who knew this, i believe there are threads about when the new album is coming out.

I thought the volume in Leeds was okay really.
It was far lower in Atlanta believe me.

Thanks for the official site quote EMWK, don't recall seeing that before. From what i heard in the post-match analysis the majority of my friends at the London Forum would've far preferred 'loud and horrible' over 'quiet and better'. Each to their own, and close to the PA did it for me this time around.

Leeds was loud enough for me even through ear plugs*.

(* I've got permanent tinnitus from too many gigs, trips to the phono etc so I now never go to gig without them. Often I can hear the gig much better then those around me as they cut out a lot of the boom and distortion.)

I felt the Cologne gig was well loud enough. I like concerts that don't leave a tinitus ringing in my ears like a foul aftertaste after a good diner.

You're really good at comparisons eotunun.

I'm one of the people who would never think about a Sisters gig as "possibly too quiet" if it weren't for the discussions I read on this forum. It just wouldn't occur to me. But I've said it about a thousand times before haven't I.

_emma_ wrote:You're really good at comparisons eotunun.

When I'm grown up, I'm gonna be a metmorphorical poet.

Not sure about everyone here but I no longer enjoy blistering volume at a gig.
Once at MBV was enough.

Balls. Just turn that fucker up!

But it would be nice to hear something.

yes, of course it would

even nicer would be to hear something, and hear it loud!

(not like it's ever going to happen though)

thanks, Lee for the quote!
I can't remember reading it before, where could it be found?

I don't feel the need for an extreme sound level situation that wold just force me to wear earplugs. But I'm expecting a volume that doesn't allow conversation without raising your voice. Sometimes the "chattering noise floor" during the shows are just horrible but you can't force the people to pay attention. Adult education sucks sometimes

ps: it's a quote taken from the outboard page (technical boys) and it's nothing new^^

Scardwel wrote:Balls. Just turn that fucker up!

Just noticed your sig line.

DocSommer wrote:it's a quote taken from the outboard page (technical boys) and it's nothing new^^

Technical boys. .... Ages ago, I remember I started reading it only because of the colours of this subpage, which are in my opinion ab-so-lu-tely beeeeeautiful, to the point that it is pure pleasure just to open the site and look at it without reading. ... Anyway, there was all that boring "technical" stuff that I couldn't understand at all, and then, at the bottom, it suddenly gets to cars, books, fencing equipment, and oil-wheel lamps. Such things make a girl like me feel like a gold-digger finding a huge nugget in the dust. Very, very Sisters, isn't it.

_emma_ wrote:... then, at the bottom, it suddenly gets to cars, books, fencing equipment, and oil-wheel lamps.

I've always been especially fond of the description of the Merc.

DocSommer wrote:I don't feel the need for an extreme sound level situation that wold just force me to wear earplugs. But I'm expecting a volume that doesn't allow conversation without raising your voice. Sometimes the "chattering noise floor" during the shows are just horrible but you can't force the people to pay attention. Adult education sucks sometimes

Amen. (Although I still don't wear earplugs... )

A large part of the problem is the arrogance, self-involvement and sheer bad manners of the audience. Too many would rather talk than actually listen (it's all television to them), or else want the volume cranked up so they can yell and sing along (badly) at the top of their lungs - pretending they're part of the band, I suppose. Do that at home, in the shower, in the living room - you should be going to a show to hear the performer(s), it's not karaoke night, FFS.

(Of course I 'sing' along as well - can't help wanting to - but I subvocalise - I'm there to hear , not myself.)

Additionally, 'loud' is part of what's made him (apparently) unable to reach those previous vocal heights.

I never sing along - that would f**k up my recordings^^ But you can't imagine what's going on when I listen to the stuff afterwards - especially on the road

... What were This Corrosion without a singing audience?
I really love everybody for doing so.

I know, I couldn't do this.

However, in general, I really prefer to hear singing
- and not the crowd around me. Sometimes impossible, .
They want to celebrate ... the Sisters, themselves, the night out ... whatever. Can't really blame anybody for that.

These conditions at concerts are, however, another reason why I'd love
(and immediately buy) a new CD without singing or even chatting crowds ...

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:an explanation for the gig volume or lack thereof? i presume this problem must be ongoing.

the official site wrote:Even now, we have to choose between being loud (and my vocal sounding horrible) or being quiet (and my vocal sounding like it should). The problem is not feedback onstage - it's feedback between the microphone and the main PA speakers when the high end is boosted sufficiently to convey the nuance and intended perceived pitch of the vocal. At the moment we're pursuing the quieter-but-better policy. I was getting too tired of having a boomy and muddy vocal which I couldn't hear above the guitars anyway. The overall live experience might have been more powerful, but the me part of it it wasn't quite me.

No offence to Big Pete the mixing engineer: it's my fault for not being able to sing as loudly as anybody else.

s**t.

So does this justify the band being s**t? You play 'warm up' shows and reherse like trojans to get this sorted out before you go on tour. The Mishun used to hire the Royal Court in Liverpool prior to some tours to get 'that sound and stage show' just right - You iron out the kinks before you fleece the audiecne. It's the law.


"Me, fail English? - the unpossible" - Ralph Wiggam.

The Mission are pretty much not existing today, could it be they rehearsed themselves to death, then?

I really think that less loudness helped all gigs I heard so far. At some point of noiselevel the buildings start making their own music, which doesn't help anyone. Feeling the bass in the bowels is nice, yes. But it's not necessary for a great gig.

Being645 wrote: I know, I couldn't do this.

Why not, it is not that there is a choice (for me at least), I just get carried away. I am sure that there are many reasons not to sing along, but still it is stronger than me.
I remember you mentioning the healing - for me singing is part of it. Sing and healing hand - it goes together. Join us next time and we do it together.

Back in time wrote:

Being645 wrote: I know, I couldn't do this.

Why not, it is not that there is a choice (for me at least), I just get carried away. I am sure that there are many reasons not to sing along, but still it is stronger than me.

There are several reasons for me not to sing along at concerts. Some reasons referring to the fact that I don't want to ...
and some other reasons why I never could do this. And as for the latter ... there is only one person, I might ever tell, if at all ...
and it would, by no means, change the fact. Full stop.

and wrote: I remember you mentioning the healing - for me singing is part of it. Sing and healing hand - it goes together. Join us next time and we do it together.

Oh yes, I remember ... a bit of a healing ...
However, on my part, singing along at concerts does not meet the point.
Insofar, I reject your indeed very kind offer. I cannot be but the one I am.

i love singing along at sisters gigs.

eastmidswhizzkid wrote:i love singing along at sisters gigs.

You're welcome to do so. At least during some songs ...
whereas during other songs you might forgive me
dreaming of a big bucket of socks for the audience ...