Heartland

On a grey Saturday afternoon such as this I can muster neither the ability to be slightly happy nor the strength of emotion to be pissed off, and so a new thread is launched.

I was working down in London this week and had to take the department trainee with me and, having arrived early, decided a curry in Brick Lane was in order. Apparently, his impression was not quite the same as mine, in that it was “just like India�. Yes, just like India - apart from the beggars, the endemic poverty, and the vast overcrowding. I guess I shouldn’t have been too surprised. After all, this was a guy who a couple of weeks earlier was in London with a colleague of mine and was amazed by the amount of “darkies� walking about – presumably in broad daylight, just like you and me. As you might have already surmised, he has a few opinions about “poofs� as well.
I had thought as a whole people’s attitudes were improving and expanding, but it seems the “small town mentality� is alive and well. The fact he reads The Sun probably says it all, except now I’m allowing my own prejudices to the fore and making the sort of generalisations I’ve just criticised. The phrase the banality of evil springs to mind, particularly as he freely admits “they� have never done anything to him. Only we’re not really dealing with evil here, more some kind of ignorance default setting. I’ve had to censure him a couple times but all it seems to have achieved is that he chooses his words with a bit more care while in my company. Is it really so hard for some people to form their own opinions based on experience and fact, particularly by the age of twenty-one? Will nothing I say make an impression on him?
I remember being told at age sixteen by a lecturer that ten years from now I’d look back and realise what an arsehole I was - I probably should make it clear that he was addressing the class as a whole at this point. Naturally, he was right, there’s a tendency on leaving school and entering employment to believe you now know everything about life and that other people have nothing to teach you. The point being that whatever else I was mistaken about, it never involved the colour of other people’s skin, their religion or sexual preferences. Given my father held the opinion that Enoch Powell was right, this is probably something of a minor miracle. To be fair, he did add the caveat that it was now too late, which I might have more readily accepted had I not perceived the wistfulness in his tone. Thank God for the parenting provided by 2000AD, for amongst the action and violence of Strontium Dog and Nemesis The Warlock was a clear message of tolerance. At the end of the day, aren’t we all mutants and aliens?
When all is said and done, perhaps I should be consoled by the fact that at least he enjoyed the curry.

I see this is another thread destined to slide down the board.

Erudite wrote:I see this is another thread destined to slide down the board.

It's Saturday Afternoon mate

Blast will be hanging about outside Aldi with a long coat on for the rest of the Summer. And Zeno must be sleeping off a huge hangover while the rest of the Benelux countries clear up his trail of destruction

As for me i'm stuck indoors out of the Glesga rain while I have to finish an End of Course Assignment on Digital Gaming to be handed in first thing monday morning.

As for what you were saying, some people will always have the wrong attitude towards another race, creed or culture. You ever see those TV adverts recently about the boyfriend physically abusing his girlfriend into sleeping with him? I thought that issue had been dealt with and was long gone

I was actually getting soaked thru on my way to mass

James Blast wrote:I was actually getting soaked thru on my way to mass

Sorry I thought it was your favourite scene

I was in London 2 times for the last 8 months,so to be honest,I was also surprised by the multinational London as well,but in the positive way.I don't really care about the colors of the skin.Guess there are people who just can't get it,I mean you can't hate or judge someone you don't really know,can you?In these insane days,i can't really be bothered judging poeple this way.The younger generations has total lack of respect and tolerance whatsoever.
I was pissed by a bus driver though,I was in a hurry for a job interview in a visual effects company in Soho,tried to buy a ticket from the driver(I found about the Oyster cards latter) ,but had 20 pounds bill,he refused to sell me a ticket,I told him it was important I must be on time.the bastard answered me,if I don't get out of the bus,everyone inside would be late as well,so it was me,who was late

Big Si wrote:
It's Saturday Afternoon mate

People actually do things of a Saturday afternoon?

Big Si wrote: You ever see those TV adverts recently about the boyfriend physically abusing his girlfriend into sleeping with him? I thought that issue had been dealt with and was long gone

You'd like to think so but a surprisingly high number of people seem to adhere to the belief that any women showing a bit of leg and/or drinking too much is asking to be raped.

Sometimes I think my misanthropy is misplaced and then I remember that most people are cunts.
Can you tell I'm reading "My Shit Life So Far" by Frankie Boyle?

Whenever people say things like that, the audacity makes me speechless. Aren't they aware at all? Or do they think it's funny?
At least he's noticed that he needs to change his words when he is around you, which is a good start I guess.
I think in general people's attitudes are indeed expanding. But it's puzzling how much it can differ in individuals in the same country and society.

Last time I was in that area, there was a bit of controversy over some bright spark wanting to rename it "Banglatown" a la Chinatown. It was slapped down because such an obvious statement of change in an area over such a short period of time wasn't considered a paticularly good idea to draw attention to. I didn't really see the logic in that, since you'd have to be blind not to notice said changes, and I have to assume the local authorities believe it to be a good thing.
London doesn't really have much of a connection to the rest of England these days, like New York and Paris, it's multinational and multiracial. Wether you consider that good or bad is one of those "eye of the beholder" things. It's certainly bought a lot of undeniable problems, perhaps because such a massive social change was never asked or approved of by the public.
I imagine some of my comments in the past have me labelled in peoples eyes here as a "Powellite" (despite me learning my third European language, having lived abroad, worked in the immigration authorities and being engaged to an Eastern European, which I would have thought would show me as being extremely open to other cultures, but never mind..) at the very least. Not having much in common with certain other cultures and thinking they can take the high road while I take the low doesn't mean I hate them or think them somehow worse than me. Just I don't relate to them and don't particularly wish to.

I don't even entertain ideas about these things, so it doesn't bother me.

now everyone, stop all yer blabber n' smoke

Nice thread. Maybe

This week, I have been in my local to play darts with a buddy of mine, watch the world cup games & put up with the attitude of one of the bar maids.

She's okay really. A vivacious 20 something year old that comes across as quite pleasant. But she can really grate on a person.

Her name is Kata. We call her Katatude.

Arriving at the bar she greets with a big smile & asks what I want to sup. Although she knows full well what I drink, she still goes through the motions.
During this, she'll talk at the top of her voice to her friends who are all sitting under the dartboard about how much work she's done that day (in the searing heat of a wine cellar btw).
It's only when I glance round, I see the chalk board's been decorated with an elaborate design, incorporating "Kata" & little heart motifs. Cleaning 9 tables, sweeping the floor & creating that "art" was the sole product of her day.

As time approaches for Eastenders on the box, she turns the music up (that no-one is listening to) in some sort of mp3 protest against the fact she has actually got customers.

My glass empties & she leaps to the bar to refill it dutifully.

Mark & I are regular dart players there (we actually buy the dart boards) & so we arrive clutching our dart boxes. But Katatude & her friends seem unmoved by all this & continue their "who shagged who" conversation without a second thought.

Eventually, they'll move & we proceed to play darts & shoot the breeze about life,, the universe & everything. Kata smiles & is friendly. But I rather suspect it is mostly because if the barrels run out she knows we can lift the new ones into place & connect them & to p*ss us off isn't conducive to us being benevolent.

As the night wears on she will get more agitated as customers request drinks. In a bar?? Heaven forbid! I've even known her to tell customers that's the last one & to pay (at 11pm ffs!).

But she's a sweetie. She does have a voice so loud it could trigger an avalanche, but she is funny. I can't dislike her. I can moan about her, but I don't really.
& there really is nowhere else to go, save the Red Dragon, but that's usually full of warring gypsy gangs.

Bottom line. She's nice. But she gets on my fcuking wick.

Going for a smoke now.....

thank you

Pista wrote:Nice thread. Maybe

etc.

James Blast wrote:I don't even entertain ideas about these things, so it doesn't bother me.

Which is probably why you'll live longer than I will.
No doubt I'm a stress induced stroke or heart attack waiting to happen, but sometimes you have to challenge people.
Well, unless there's ten of them and they have baseball bats, in which case calling them bigots is perhaps not so wise.

I've allas lived by the tenet:
"charity begins at home"

I look efter ma ain, n' they look efter me - I also have enough problems (health wise) of ma ain that, I tend not to worry about color, creed or orientation, take a spell in hospital and you'll see what a leveler that can be

In Dublin I've seen, especially in the past 10 or so years, quite a massive influx of foreign nationals. Right now I live in what's practically a Chinatown, there are African food shops all over the place, where I work every other shop on the street seems to be Polish or Russian, there is a Mosque next door, good Italian and Thai restaurants abound, a few weeks ago we even had Polish election posters go up, yesterday I was getting some money from a local ATM and I think I counted a total of two people speaking English among those passing by during the 10 minutes I was there.

Me, I think it's nothing short of wonderful. Anything that opens your eyes to different cultures, different nationalities, different ways of life, and the fact that there is a whole world out there that blows away all of the narrower preconceptions you may have grown up with has to be a great thing.

I can kind of understand how those who may not have been exposed to this can feel a little uneasy about it; fear and caution are natural enough reactions to the unknown. But open displays of contempt are pathetically depressing, and almost hark back to the mentalities of cavemen warring with the neighbouring tribe across the river for no reason other than that they're different.

Sigh. At the end of the day you've just got to get on with your own life really, and hope that as societies mature there will come a time when all of this just seems like a silly little period in our past.

Fear, as you say, is the key.
I can't quite decide if it's in our nature to be afraid of the unknown, what is different, or if there's something in the make up of our society that instils it into us.

Don't drink and post Steve

I work on the premise that, when you have real dossey people, who live for "the king of the gypsies" Jeremy Kile, and when they are next getting their social cheque to buy beer with, how can anyone say that anyone who wants to come to our sweet little island, WORK, and make a better life for themseves are "taking our jobs"? What a load of sh!t, ok work is scarse, but, I've seen the que outside the post office on a tuesday morning, full of people wearing the latest Nike/Adidas/Bench(add whatever sports brand you've seen) who "can't afford" to pay their electric/gas but have a 50" plasma and xstationbox?? I've been waiting for a new dentist for seven months now, and, if I was a jobseaker, I'd get one for free. I feel for the people who want to work, but, can't. but I have no respect for anyone who says that the influx of migrant workers causes anything!!!! I'm not a facist, I just hate TW@Ts.. Rant over for my 100th post!!!

Good point

Erudite wrote:.........amongst the action and violence of .. Nemesis The Warlock was a clear message of tolerance.

There was?

mh wrote: Sigh. At the end of the day you've just got to get on with your own life really, and hope that as societies mature there will come a time when all of this just seems like a silly little period in our past.

That were nice, but I wonder ... because, for example over here in Germany,
that sort of discrimination is as structural as it is state-made ...

If by any chance you are a guy with a wife and two kids with a migratory
background and your income doesn't pay the rent, you will be entitled to
housing benefit ...
BUT: as soon as any person is entitled to any benefit, every adult and unemployed
person in this household will be asked to take on whatever job ...

Let's say so far so fine ...
Now, as your wife - since the kids are old enough - is able to take on
a job, she has to appear at the unemployment agency and give account
of her former employments, her education and so on ...

As it shows, before the kids she was working for 10 years as a tailor
for a textile company ... had a normal income and everything ...

The unemployment agency is however as unable as unwilling to deliver
a job to her, but in order to get her employed at any rate, they tell her:

"Hey, you are nearly 50 (which, in fact, is still a few years ahead) and you
wear a headscarf (which she voluntarily does, because - unlike you - she is Muslim)
... you won't get a regular job, anyway. So you have to take on this "intergration job" ...

The latter are paid with 1€ per hour and, originally, were limited to six months.
Meanwhile it's possible to make you work at that "wage" for two years ...
In case she should reject, the housing benefit were withdrawn ...

Of course, at the same time German TV screens and papers are flooded almost daily
with social-benefit abuser basking in the Lanzarote sunhine or other such sceneries ...

Congrats. In Germany, we call it intergration ... there might be other
definitions ... like Learning from India is learning to win ... ...

theparadox2010 wrote:I work on the premise that, when you have real dossey people, who live for "the king of the gypsies" Jeremy Kile, and when they are next getting their social cheque to buy beer with, how can anyone say that anyone who wants to come to our sweet little island, WORK, and make a better life for themseves are "taking our jobs"? What a load of sh!t, ok work is scarse, but, I've seen the que outside the post office on a tuesday morning, full of people wearing the latest Nike/Adidas/Bench(add whatever sports brand you've seen) who "can't afford" to pay their electric/gas but have a 50" plasma and xstationbox?? I've been waiting for a new dentist for seven months now, and, if I was a jobseaker, I'd get one for free. I feel for the people who want to work, but, can't. but I have no respect for anyone who says that the influx of migrant workers causes anything!!!! I'm not a facist, I just hate TW@Ts.. Rant over for my 100th post!!!

You know, youre ranting in the EXACT same way some do against migrants against the poor. You're even throwing in a shedload of cliched facts you can't possibly prove. I seem to remember finding it rather difficult to eat a meal a day on JSA, never mind plasma screens and XBox's. Mind you, as a Southern taxpayer for every year of my working life, I was scum under Labour, so maybe it was their idea of punishment.
It's simple mathematics that if you have more people chasing a finite resource, someone loses out. And if you bring in cheaper labour to an already tense job market, people will become unemployed.
Now if you want to rail against the employers who are happy to exploit cheap labour whilst throwing generations of poor on the scrapheap of JSA and constant "restart" courses(which exist purely to keep JCP staff employed!)..

DeWinter wrote: ...
Now if you want to rail against the employers who are happy to exploit cheap labour whilst throwing generations of poor on the scrapheap of JSA and constant "restart" courses(which exist purely to keep JCP staff employed!)..

Same over here ...

Being645 wrote: That were nice, but I wonder ... because, for example over here in Germany,
that sort of discrimination is as structural as it is state-made ...

If by any chance you are a guy with a wife and two kids with a migratory
background and your income doesn't pay the rent, you will be entitled to
housing benefit ...
BUT: as soon as any person is entitled to any benefit, every adult and unemployed
person in this household will be asked to take on whatever job ...

Let's say so far so fine ...
Now, as your wife - since the kids are old enough - is able to take on
a job, she has to appear at the unemployment agency and give account
of her former employments, her education and so on ...

As it shows, before the kids she was working for 10 years as a tailor
for a textile company ... had a normal income and everything ...

The unemployment agency is however as unable as unwilling to deliver
a job to her, but in order to get her employed at any rate, they tell her:

"Hey, you are nearly 50 (which, in fact, is still a few years ahead) and you
wear a headscarf (which she voluntarily does, because - unlike you - she is Muslim)
... you won't get a regular job, anyway. So you have to take on this "intergration job" ...

The latter are paid with 1€ per hour and, originally, were limited to six months.
Meanwhile it's possible to make you work at that "wage" for two years ...
In case she should reject, the housing benefit were withdrawn ...

Of course, at the same time German TV screens and papers are flooded almost daily
with social-benefit abuser basking in the Lanzarote sunhine or other such sceneries ...

Congrats. In Germany, we call it intergration ... there might be other
definitions ... like Learning from India is learning to win ... ...

We have the same thing here. Job Centre hires you out full time to some company and you get something like £20 extra on benefits for it. So £20 added to £55 benefits, maybe £70 housing benefit, roughly £145 for a full weeks work. About £4.15 an hour.