Heartland

I am sure this has been discussed to death but.....why are there such good recordings of 84/85 shows?

Also, why doesn't sell discs of the shows akin to Metallica, Pearl Jam, etc?

I think the recording gear back than wasn't that bad at all - some tapes may sound worser than other because they are degenerated during generation copies or poor storage conditions.

DocSommer wrote:I think the recording gear back than wasn't that bad at all - some tapes may sound worser than other because they are degenerated during generation copies or poor storage conditions.

I get that but recently many of the boots don't hold a candle to those early tapes. Just wondering

A direct comparison is hardly possible because the band is playing a totally different sound today - some might even say it sounds less good/tight/audible/whatever compared to the 90s or 80s sound era.

If you use state of the art gear and a time machine to record a gig in the 80s I'm shure you will like the result.

DocSommer wrote:A direct comparison is hardly possible because the band is playing a totally different sound today - some might even say it sounds less good/tight/audible/whatever compared to the 90s or 80s sound era.

If you use state of the art gear and a time machine to record a gig in the 80s I'm shure you will like the result.

Good point doc, the livwe sound now does tend to erm suck?

Well it definetly tends to sound different

If you say they suck these days then I must say they sucked back then as well because they never delivered a technically perfect gig. If you expect a live sound close to album recordings ypu'll probably have to look for other artists.

I think a sisters gig can provide everything from pain to gain. I left gigs telling myself "wow, this sucked" as well as I've seen gigs I really liked so I'm definetly (Edit: NOT) that kind of fanboy who doesn't care what happen on stage because I got drunk before the show started (to avoid realizing it might be a s**t performance).

DocSommer wrote:Well it definetly tends to sound different

If you say they suck these days then I must say they sucked back then as well because they never delivered a technically perfect gig. If you expect a live sound close to album recordings ypu'll probably have to look for other artists.

I think a sisters gig can provide everything from pain to gain. I left gigs telling myself "wow, this sucked" as well as I've seen gigs I really liked so I'm definetly that kind fanboy who doesn't care what happen on stage because I got drunk before the show started (to avoid realizing it might be a s**t performance).

I am talking about the sound in general. I actually like it when or the band screws up, he always has a great comment

Ok then, well I like the recent sound in general. I think a problem is that the sound is often quite too boomy for most room acoustic situations. This is always - more or less - a problem during concerts but I think the sisters are struggeling with that issue more than other acts. If you check out different positions during a show you'll notice many spots where you can't hear much more than humming bass sounds. If these "bad sounds" areas occupies maybe 30% of the venues audience capacity you will see many really disappointed visitors, especially during "sold out" conditions where people can't really move to different spots.

There's also a tendency noticeable that the feedback after "open air" events is better compared to club gigs. I think the answere is that you have usually less "room acoustics" issues in this situation plus more headroom for turning up the vocals.

It was the era of Sisters soundboard recordings AFAIK.

Ozpat wrote:It was the era of Sisters soundboard recordings AFAIK.

That makes sense, bring them back!

I still want to know why isn't selling recording of the shows like Metallica etc?

We will never get a studio album, so.............................

Because is an ornery git who likes to p*ss off his fanbase?

markfiend wrote:Because is an ornery git who likes to p*ss off his fanbase?

I forgot about that

We love him anyway.

n'Emolicia wrote:We love him anyway.

Hmm my contempt is giving way to chronic indifference!

BillyBadBreaks wrote:I still want to know why isn't selling recording of the shows like Metallica etc?

We will never get a studio album, so.............................

... because they are all bootlegged, anyway? ... ...

Being645 wrote:

BillyBadBreaks wrote:I still want to know why isn't selling recording of the shows like Metallica etc?

We will never get a studio album, so.............................

... because they are all bootlegged, anyway? ... ...

what is a bootleg?

I am just thinking quality wise

an abstract painting, a snapshot, a draft ... ...

* which does not exclude quality per se

Being645 wrote:an abstract painting, a snapshot, a draft ... ...

* which does not exclude quality per se

yes, that exactly is
variations of paintings in the same theme
none can play a song exactly the same two times, like the paintings...
none can paint exactly the same painting twice...
every time we hear a live played song it is slightly different from all the others before

referring to the topics starting point it is really "interesting", how different recordings qualitywise can sound these days. even some of state of art equipement which people in here use sounds exremely steril and clean, as the equipement absorbes parts of the signal identifying it as noise or whatever. they sound digital. people use very small mics, which also affects the recording.

listening to even perfect recordings of gigs i have been to shows the difference between a recording and actually being there, which is a basic issue. the best recording sometimes does not feature what you expierience (and actiually hear) at a gig.

but i agree, many of the 85 recordings do sound fantastic, but this is due to the fact that some of them really were fantastic, and craigs bass was an audible monster

Being645 wrote:

BillyBadBreaks wrote:I still want to know why isn't selling recording of the shows like Metallica etc?

We will never get a studio album, so.............................

... because they are all bootlegged, anyway? ... ...

Aye!

listening to even perfect recordings of gigs i have been to shows the difference between a recording and actually being there, which is a basic issue. the best recording sometimes does not feature what you expierience (and actiually hear) at a gig.

I occasionally experienced this vice versa, means the recordings sounds way better than I would have expected it, especially after shows I didn't liked (soundwise). Cardoid mics tends to supress most of the room acoustic influences (compared to binaural mics or the human ear) - that's a pro in most cases but also a matter of taste of course. Other tapers prefer using binaural mics in general to gain a more "boomy" sound.

DocSommer wrote:

listening to even perfect recordings of gigs i have been to shows the difference between a recording and actually being there, which is a basic issue. the best recording sometimes does not feature what you expierience (and actiually hear) at a gig.

I occasionally experienced this vice versa, means the recordings sounds way better than I would have expected it, especially after shows I didn't liked (soundwise). Cardoid mics tends to supress most of the room acoustic influences (compared to binaural mics or the human ear) - that's a pro in most cases but also a matter of taste of course. Other tapers prefer using binaural mics in general to gain a more "boomy" sound.

the types of mics used are a big point of course. and as you have noted, the relations between a gig and its recording(s) exist in all variations. its always funny to recognise (the recording of) a certain gig only by its special soundcharacteristics, like the sound of a snaredrum for example.

A very common mic in those days was this one:

clicky

Aachen 85 was taped with that one... [/url]

I believe the reason is this:

In the early days, The Sisters did not bring their own audio engineer to the venue. The band was mixed by the "in-house" mixer, who could be bought off easily (especially, it seems, in Amsterdam) for a few beers by a dude wanting to run a direct line into his tape recorder from the mixing desk stereo-output jack. I know for a fact that this is how the Melkweg show was recorded.

Nice to see you all again.