Heartland

While perusing my housemate's copy of the August issue of Jane magazine (women's rag for 18 to 30 year olds), I noticed a half-page feature in the fashion section dotted with pop-goth t-shirts and handbags. The blurb reads thus:

"All those little goth kids are probably beyond depressed now that the best designers are making skull-and-crossbones motifs high fashion. Sisters of Mercy, you have our sympathy, but this is our Labor Day barbecue look."

Better not tell Andy!

It's just too horrible to comment on, isn't it?

<------speachless

i just heard a reference to sisters on an australian comedy show

man: so what do you think of the 'sisters of mercy' (reffering to the charity organization)

blonde: im more into 'savage garden' myself

there's just no excuse for that, he/she should have been taken outside and bludgeonded do death, Cabbage Garden are woeful

It pretty much sums up 'lazy journalism', something that I'm sure has plagued Von from the beginning, and part of the reason he can't be bothered rushing to return to the music industry. I guess if you're doing an article on 'goth' fashion, and you need a quick reference or 'fact', they throw in The Sisters, or The Cure, and you're supposed to just swallow the reference. Same old, same old.

Goth as a style of dress is pretty impractical during the daytime, isn't it? Especially if you're living in a hot climate.

As for the goth music scene itself, it seems to have gotten worse over the years. The original 'goth' bands, like Sisters, Birthday Party, Virgin Prunes, all had a bit of humour in what they were doing (yes, even the Birthday Party) but now the bands - and their followers even more so - all seem incredibly dorky.

Hmmm.... Seventeenth century Transylvanians running around with electric guitars. Daniel Ash has a lot to answer for!

Black Biscuit wrote:Goth as a style of dress is pretty impractical during the daytime, isn't it? Especially if you're living in a hot climate.

As for the goth music scene itself, it seems to have gotten worse over the years. The original 'goth' bands, like Sisters, Birthday Party, Virgin Prunes, all had a bit of humour in what they were doing (yes, even the Birthday Party) but now the bands - and their followers even more so - all seem incredibly dorky.

Hmmm.... Seventeenth century Transylvanians running around with electric guitars. Daniel Ash has a lot to answer for!

"Goth" nowadays seems to just be a contest of who can be the spookiest and most contrary. And it all winds up being laughably ridiculous. They all pride themselves on being "individuals", but I swear I can't tell them apart. Maybe I'm just getting old. Oh well, off to have my fiber and yell at my kids to turn than infernal racket down.

PS- I'm sure this topic has been run into the ground, but I've never thought of SOM as goth. Maybe I'm listening to it wrong.

CtrlAltDelete wrote:

Black Biscuit wrote:Goth as a style of dress is pretty impractical during the daytime, isn't it? Especially if you're living in a hot climate.

As for the goth music scene itself, it seems to have gotten worse over the years. The original 'goth' bands, like Sisters, Birthday Party, Virgin Prunes, all had a bit of humour in what they were doing (yes, even the Birthday Party) but now the bands - and their followers even more so - all seem incredibly dorky.

Hmmm.... Seventeenth century Transylvanians running around with electric guitars. Daniel Ash has a lot to answer for!

"Goth" nowadays seems to just be a contest of who can be the spookiest and most contrary. And it all winds up being laughably ridiculous. They all pride themselves on being "individuals", but I swear I can't tell them apart. Maybe I'm just getting old. Oh well, off to have my fiber and yell at my kids to turn than infernal racket down.

PS- I'm sure this topic has been run into the ground, but I've never thought of SOM as goth. Maybe I'm listening to it wrong.

all depends on what you define as goth.

there is a flavour of goth (to which i have always prescribed) of which is eldritch is pretty much the living embodiment

on the surface of things fairly austere and "germanic", hard-faced, cold and intelligent

underneath, a very dry (and wry) sense of humour, quite detached but at the same time quite intrigued by one's immediate environment

i was never into the 14th century vampire nonsense, but by that definition above the sisters are VERY goth.

not being a fan, mrs quiff boy is a relative outside when it comes to all things sistersy. she has seen a few modern sisters boots & videos and heard a few bootleg recordings (bless her!) and she says that the 2004 version of eldritch (eg: as seen on the "suzanne" video) is even more goth that the 1984 version... his entire attutude, all the up-its-arse clever-clever suff he says in interviews, all those psuedo-oblique remarks and in-jokes, all the little catch phrases anout things being pretty & cruel, letc etc - its all so achingly "goff" and uber-cool it hurts

the difference between myself and mrs qb however is that i think that is a good thing , where as she finds it all rather amusing

^^^ That.

Well, apart from the fact that mrs mf is quite a Sisters fan too.

all depends on what you define as goth.

there is a flavour of goth (to which i have always prescribed) of which is eldritch is pretty much the living embodiment

on the surface of things fairly austere and "germanic", hard-faced, cold and intelligent

underneath, a very dry (and wry) sense of humour, quite detached but at the same time quite intrigued by one's immediate environment

i was never into the 14th century vampire nonsense, but by that definition above the sisters are VERY goth.

not being a fan, mrs quiff boy is a relative outside when it comes to all things sistersy. she has seen a few modern sisters boots & videos and heard a few bootleg recordings (bless her!) and she says that the 2004 version of eldritch (eg: as seen on the "suzanne" video) is even more goth that the 1984 version... his entire attutude, all the up-its-arse clever-clever suff he says in interviews, all those psuedo-oblique remarks and in-jokes, all the little catch phrases anout things being pretty & cruel, letc etc - its all so achingly "goff" and uber-cool it hurts

the difference between myself and mrs qb however is that i think that is a good thing , where as she finds it all rather amusing [/quote]



It also depends on where you live. Here in the states, goth (for the most part) is wildly different from what it is in other parts of the world (namely, Europe). Here it's all about being depressed, tragic, misunderstood... you know, back of the hand to the forhead sort of stuff (also read as "woe is me"). Crushed velvet and vampires also figure largely into this equation. This is pretty much the goth we know in the states, which is why I don't see SOM as being even a little bit gothic. But by other standards (where goth isn't such a travesty), I can see how the term goth might fit for SOM.

CtrlAltDelete wrote:It also depends on where you live. Here in the states, goth (for the most part) is wildly different from what it is in other parts of the world (namely, Europe). Here it's all about being depressed, tragic, misunderstood... you know, back of the hand to the forhead sort of stuff (also read as "woe is me"). Crushed velvet and vampires also figure largely into this equation. This is pretty much the goth we know in the states, which is why I don't see SOM as being even a little bit gothic. But by other standards (where goth isn't such a travesty), I can see how the term goth might fit for SOM.

a good point. and that US-centric version you describe fits with the cliched amercian goth whom most british goths see as having missed the point somewhat

there;s no point wearing all that make up and spending all that time doing one's hair if you'renot going to go out and have a good laugh

you could stay in, close your curtains, put on "pornography" and mope, and save a lot of time, effort and money

Quiff Boy wrote:that US-centric version you describe fits with the cliched amercian goth whom most british goths see as having missed the point somewhat

---- Marilyn Manson is an exceptional salesman, but behind his "shock rock" is a kid who was always really dorky and you can still see it. Birds of a feather flock together, and he has managed to "sell the don't belong" remarkably well.

The geographical distinction is a good one - the dorky stuff is probably more American and 'nu metal' oriented. Cleopatra records, Manson again, et al.

The Brit stuff was always more subtle and diverse. So many British bands/artists could be loosely classified as goth, or acceptable to goth ears - from Psychic TV to Gary Numan to Cocteau Twins to The Cult to The Damned to Cindytalk to Killing Joke....

Black Biscuit wrote:

Quiff Boy wrote:that US-centric version you describe fits with the cliched amercian goth whom most british goths see as having missed the point somewhat

---- Marilyn Manson is an exceptional salesman, but behind his "shock rock" is a kid who was always really dorky and you can still see it. Birds of a feather flock together, and he has managed to "sell the don't belong" remarkably well.

The geographical distinction is a good one - the dorky stuff is probably more American and 'nu metal' oriented. Cleopatra records, Manson again, et al.

The Brit stuff was always more subtle and diverse. So many British bands/artists could be loosely classified as goth, or acceptable to goth ears - from Psychic TV to Gary Numan to Cocteau Twins to Cindytalk to Killing Joke....

yup, i think you're spot on with both points there.

Black Biscuit wrote:Marilyn Manson is an exceptional salesman,

Oof! I'm not disagreeing with you, but fuckin' hell! That's seriously below the belt thing to say about anyone who calls themself an "artist"!

Quiff Boy wrote:there is a flavour of goth (to which i have always prescribed) of which is eldritch is pretty much the living embodiment on the surface of things fairly austere and "germanic", hard-faced, cold and intelligent

underneath, a very dry (and wry) sense of humour, quite detached but at the same time quite intrigued by one's immediate environment

---- That doesn't describe Eldritch. It describes me!

As for Eldo, he could well be in the "I'm so gothic, I'm dead" category. No-one's seen or heard from him for years, it seems.