Heartland

I mean really, Superman is a bit rubbish. I know he's the first superhero and all that, but it's not exactly a *hard* concept or one that wouldn't have emerged anyway, all they did is take mythological superheroes and put a cape on them. In fact, if anything, Superman is responsible for many of the things that are *wrong* with earlier comics.

Batman, on the other hand, is much cooler. With the exception of that s**t movie with "Mista Fwreeeeze" he is for the most part a much better developed character, darker instead of camp. He has cool gadgets, and despite being spoiled and rich he still has real issues, and he still manages to be human and vulnerable. What does Superman have? A gay costume. AND ONE WEAKNESS. Oh boy. Kryptonite. And it took them so long to realise this, and when they did, instead of changing the format to show the issues an "invincible" being may have, Sandman style, or simply have him discover more weaknesses as time went on(There was actually one villian who was quite cool who drained Superman's energy, a kind of loophole, that was one good one but I don't think that came till later either) they killed him and brought him back weaker. Then how the f**k is he going to fight all the old villians!? Who were s**t compared to Batman, anyway. Apocalips? WTF? Is he some kind of sassy male prostitute? So damn gay.
Batman has any number of nifty costumes, why have they never given Superman a decent one? Are they afraid he'll loose his position as Gay Icon of the Universe?

Plus Batman has a butler.

DOES SUPERMAN HAVE A BUTLER!?

I didn't think so.

If he did, he'd probably be called "Francis" or some gay name than that.

Batman is cool. Superman is not so good. Go spread your outerunderpants fashion style somewhere else.

Next time: Is Professor X on LSD?

You do like to light the blue touch paper don't you?

Johnny M wrote:You do like to light the blue touch paper don't you?

What are you talking about, man?

Rosalie wrote:A gay costume.

1960s Batman = grey lycra bodysuit with big blue hotpants over the top

1990s Batman = black rubber bodysuit specially formed to make him look extra butch

Still nowhere near as gay as Superman. You can understand Batman's "armour". Plus he has the cool Batwings thing going on these days.

if we ignore it do you think it'll go away?

The thing I prefer about The Batman is his moral ambiguity. In things like "Arkham Asylum" he's perhaps as much a psychopathic lunatic as The Joker et al. And this is what things are like in the "real world"; morality isn't just a black-and-white issue but an infinite gradation of greys. But Supes is "perfectly good" while the baddies are "perfectly bad." Typical neo-con either/or thinking. Superman is the perfect American for the McCarthy era and the Bush dynasty, its heir apparent.

Also, The Batman's just a "normal guy" (OK he's as rich as Croesus) whereas Superman is an alien.

Mark Gemini Thwaite is a huge batman fan.
(whaaat? I'm in a troublemaking mood!)

RicheyJames wrote:if we ignore it do you think it'll go away?

i never thought i'd... but

markfiend wrote:The thing I prefer about The Batman is his moral ambiguity. In things like "Arkham Asylum" he's perhaps as much a psychopathic lunatic as The Joker et al. And this is what things are like in the "real world"; morality isn't just a black-and-white issue but an infinite gradation of greys. But Supes is "perfectly good" while the baddies are "perfectly bad." Typical neo-con either/or thinking. Superman is the perfect American for the McCarthy era and the Bush dynasty, its heir apparent.

But now 'moral ambiguity' has been done to death - in an odd way it's almost refreshing to go back to a simpler good guy / bad guy scenario...

smiscandlon wrote:

markfiend wrote:The thing I prefer about The Batman is his moral ambiguity. In things like "Arkham Asylum" he's perhaps as much a psychopathic lunatic as The Joker et al. And this is what things are like in the "real world"; morality isn't just a black-and-white issue but an infinite gradation of greys. But Supes is "perfectly good" while the baddies are "perfectly bad." Typical neo-con either/or thinking. Superman is the perfect American for the McCarthy era and the Bush dynasty, its heir apparent.

But now 'moral ambiguity' has been done to death - in an odd way it's almost refreshing to go back to a simpler good guy / bad guy scenario...

No it's not.
Case in point - Doctor who. Clearly the best and coolest thing in the world, ever.

d00mw0lf wrote:

smiscandlon wrote:

markfiend wrote:The thing I prefer about The Batman is his moral ambiguity. In things like "Arkham Asylum" he's perhaps as much a psychopathic lunatic as The Joker et al. And this is what things are like in the "real world"; morality isn't just a black-and-white issue but an infinite gradation of greys. But Supes is "perfectly good" while the baddies are "perfectly bad." Typical neo-con either/or thinking. Superman is the perfect American for the McCarthy era and the Bush dynasty, its heir apparent.

But now 'moral ambiguity' has been done to death - in an odd way it's almost refreshing to go back to a simpler good guy / bad guy scenario...

No it's not.
Case in point - Doctor who. Clearly the best and coolest thing in the world, ever.

Funny - Doctor Who was actually what I had in mind as the typical good guy / bad guy thing. I'm sure Terrance Dicks would back me up.

RicheyJames wrote:if we ignore it do you think it'll go away?

Gee, I wonder. I've been thinking about clicking that button on you for a while now. I'd only see your quotes in other people's posts though.

Is he buggery! He's a renegade timelord. If you look at it from the right angles, he's every bit as bad as the Master or the Rani.

smiscandlon wrote:

d00mw0lf wrote:

smiscandlon wrote: But now 'moral ambiguity' has been done to death - in an odd way it's almost refreshing to go back to a simpler good guy / bad guy scenario...

No it's not.
Case in point - Doctor who. Clearly the best and coolest thing in the world, ever.

Funny - Doctor Who was actually what I had in mind as the typical good guy / bad guy thing. I'm sure Terrance Dicks would back me up.

You haven't watched the new series... or some of the best eps of the old one. The Leisure Hive even comes to mind. Was he entirely wrong to want to continue the race in that way, or was he just selfish and misguided on the wrong path to doing so?

And yeah, the Doctor is a *renegade* Time Lord, but he's not a bad guy, and neither or the Gallifreyans or Timelords. So how is that black and white..?

d00mw0lf wrote:Is he buggery! He's a renegade timelord. If you look at it from the right angles, he's every bit as bad as the Master or the Rani.

Buggery bollocks. Just watched The War Games, and the Doctor is thoroughly affronted when the War Chief suggests that they're two of a kind.

So there.

Rosalie wrote:If he did, he'd probably be called "Francis" or some gay name than that.

Francis!

boudicca wrote:

Rosalie wrote:If he did, he'd probably be called "Francis" or some gay name than that.

Francis!

I'm sure she was just using that as a general example of a gay name, and nothing personal was intended.

Batman and Superman are both rubbish.
Bring on Eric Draven.

smiscandlon wrote:

d00mw0lf wrote:Is he buggery! He's a renegade timelord. If you look at it from the right angles, he's every bit as bad as the Master or the Rani.

Buggery bollocks. Just watched The War Games, and the Doctor is thoroughly affronted when the War Chief suggests that they're two of a kind.

So there.

Well you would be, wouldn't you?
In Shada, the Doctor notes that Salyavin (a criminal mastermind) was "a boyhood hero" of his.
In the last series - he told the Dalek "god" he would always take the coward's way out.
He was exiled to Earth for faffing about with other planets and pissing the timelords off.
His future regeneration (The Valeyard) was pure evil - he even brought Colin baker's regeneration back to gallifrey, put him on trial and then tried to kill him.
Ok, so the doc's not "just evil" but he can hardly be considered a good guy either.

Dark wrote:Batman and Superman are both rubbish.
Bring on Eric Draven.

GGGggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg
gggoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
tttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
thhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

d00mw0lf wrote:

smiscandlon wrote:

d00mw0lf wrote:Is he buggery! He's a renegade timelord. If you look at it from the right angles, he's every bit as bad as the Master or the Rani.

Buggery bollocks. Just watched The War Games, and the Doctor is thoroughly affronted when the War Chief suggests that they're two of a kind.

So there.

Well you would be, wouldn't you?
In Shada, the Doctor notes that Salyavin (a criminal mastermind) was "a boyhood hero" of his.
In the last series - he told the Dalek "god" he would always take the coward's way out.
He was exiled to Earth for faffing about with other planets and pissing the timelords off.
His future regeneration (The Valeyard) was pure evil - he even brought Colin baker's regeneration back to gallifrey, put him on trial and then tried to kill him.
Ok, so the doc's not "just evil" but he can hardly be considered a good guy either.

He'll always be a good guy to me.

Dark wrote:Batman and Superman are both rubbish.
Bring on Eric Draven.

You da man.

smiscandlon wrote:

d00mw0lf wrote:

smiscandlon wrote: Buggery bollocks. Just watched The War Games, and the Doctor is thoroughly affronted when the War Chief suggests that they're two of a kind.

So there.

Well you would be, wouldn't you?
In Shada, the Doctor notes that Salyavin (a criminal mastermind) was "a boyhood hero" of his.
In the last series - he told the Dalek "god" he would always take the coward's way out.
He was exiled to Earth for faffing about with other planets and pissing the timelords off.
His future regeneration (The Valeyard) was pure evil - he even brought Colin baker's regeneration back to gallifrey, put him on trial and then tried to kill him.
Ok, so the doc's not "just evil" but he can hardly be considered a good guy either.

He'll always be a good guy to me.

All the same, I'm getting off this planet before satalite 5 gets up and running!

You ain't seen nuthin' til you've seen Mr. Sinister as The Ultimate Superhero