Politics? Nah

[ribbons69]

Some thoughts :

Misogyny still alive and well (look at early stats)

We are still fighting the US Civil War

Democrats still a mess

9 of 10 states voted down abortion ban

One country lived under the rule of a narcissist fascist for 13 years. We can handle another 4

There won’t be a January 6 uprising

Glad I saw TSOM play in US maybe for last time

Kansas City Chiefs American football ball team won in over time last night. They are now 8-0

Let’s all pray for the US Joint Chiefs to once again have a back up plan if Trump moves his fingers to initiate nuclear use

There are many, many reasons for someone to vote against Harris other than misogyny; that's a lazy argument.

It may be a lazy argument but is it wrong? Will America ever elect a female President? Both times they had that choice they went for Trump instead.

[sultan2075]

Some thoughts :

Misogyny still alive and well (look at early stats)

We are still fighting the US Civil War

Democrats still a mess

9 of 10 states voted down abortion ban

One country lived under the rule of a narcissist fascist for 13 years. We can handle another 4

There won’t be a January 6 uprising

Glad I saw TSOM play in US maybe for last time

Kansas City Chiefs American football ball team won in over time last night. They are now 8-0

Let’s all pray for the US Joint Chiefs to once again have a back up plan if Trump moves his fingers to initiate nuclear use

There are many, many reasons for someone to vote against Harris other than misogyny; that's a lazy argument.

It may be a lazy argument but is it wrong? Will America ever elect a female President? Both times they had that choice they went for Trump instead.

Of course America will elect a female president. But she won’t be elected because she’s female.

Again, this is a lazy argument. There are actual reasons people vote for and against candidates. “It’s sexism” or “it’s racism” are ways people avoid confronting or addressing those reasons. That’s how the American pundit class got blindsided by this. That’s how most of my colleagues in political science got blindsided too.

[GC]

There are many, many reasons for someone to vote against Harris other than misogyny; that's a lazy argument.

It may be a lazy argument but is it wrong? Will America ever elect a female President? Both times they had that choice they went for Trump instead.

Of course America will elect a female president. But she won’t be elected because she’s female.

Again, this is a lazy argument. There are actual reasons people vote for and against candidates. “It’s sexism” or “it’s racism” are ways people avoid confronting or addressing those reasons. That’s how the American pundit class got blindsided by this. That’s how most of my colleagues in political science got blindsided too.

The majority of white women voted for Trump. The (overwhelming) majority of black women voted for Harris. (Data from The Guardian)
Dont know where Im going with this point but very interesting in the context of misogony and racism.

[Electrochrome]

I remain convinced that a large portion of the American electorate votes based primarily on 1) the price of a gallon of gas, and 2) the price of eggs and milk. That's it. Everything else is an abstraction. Cost of living is important, yes, but people apply some sort of magical power to the President to control the price of gas and food. I do think millions of Americans would accept a president for life and a nationalized oil industry that fixed the price of a gallon of gas. As long as they have that, they'll happily accept you gutting their services, outsourcing their jobs and further widening the wealth gap. They can always blame someone else.

[GC]

I remain convinced that a large portion of the American electorate votes based primarily on 1) the price of a gallon of gas, and 2) the price of eggs and milk. That's it. Everything else is an abstraction. Cost of living is important, yes, but people apply some sort of magical power to the President to control the price of gas and food. I do think millions of Americans would accept a president for life and a nationalized oil industry that fixed the price of a gallon of gas. As long as they have that, they'll happily accept you gutting their services, outsourcing their jobs and further widening the wealth gap. They can always blame someone else.

I agree, I think economic and possibly religion played a greater role than misogony and racism.

[Bartek]

As long as they have that, they'll happily accept you gutting their services, outsourcing their jobs and further widening the wealth gap.

Well if you look at the map and correlate it with election results you can find that, yes indeed gas and groceries price are important factor, but de-industrialization, offshoring, outsourcing, it the biggest factor here. I can see in another company I'm in that, even in IT jobs are outsourced to other countries (to be honest that's why I got the job, but now it's India as main and first destination), so in manufacturing and other sectors it even worst.
Trump started the trend, Biden continued it and actually did it, CHIPS and Science Act, is just one example of this, but, because effect is as always a bit delayed, people get frustrated. And because of that migration is also a part of this jigsaw. And still message/marketing of Trump is just more appealing to the majority.

And Germany on the other hand .... that coalition was a shamble from the beginning.

[longtimelurker]

The majority of white women voted for Trump. The (overwhelming) majority of black women voted for Harris. (Data from The Guardian)
Dont know where Im going with this point but very interesting in the context of misogony and racism.

The majority of white women also voted for Trump in 2016 & 2020. It's what white women do! Blaming misogynoir in 2024 seems tenuous at best. The Democrat party has been reliant upon winning "people of color" by absurd margins, particularly Black women, for quite a while now.

What might be more interesting is to find the race/gender breakdown from when Obama faced off against Hillary Clinton in the 2008 primaries. My memories are hazy, but I do remember Clinton running a somewhat racist campaign against Obama: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/can-blac ... _b_9312004


(just for the record, i've never voted for trump, lest someone get the wrong impression)

[sharedgum]

@sultan2075

First of all, yes, you are right, there have been conflicts during the Obama years (as well as Obama and Trump drone attacks), but my point is that in terms of the scale of these conflicts, it has been less than before, in comparison to Iraq and Afghanistan. I feel bad for saying this, because one civilian casualty is one too many, but I just don't know how else to describe it.
.
Back to your other points - when you say that I am "too outraged," you are no longer providing an explanation and theories (which is what everyone else seems to be doing), but you are providing justifications and telling me how to feel. Did you not read my point about Trump trying to forcefully overturn results of an election, while Harris peacefully congratulated her opponent? Did he not call the Georgia Secretary of State and tell him to "find him some 15,000 votes", or whatever it was? Did his mob not attack the Capitol on January 6 and chant "hang Mike Pence"? Is that not a reason to be fearful? His own chief of staff called him a fascist.

Hopefully, when your young students said that they were going to vote for Trump because they did not want to get drafted, you noted to them that they should use their critical thinking skills more - i.e., that draft has not been around for 50+ years, that this is a debunked claim and that at no point did Harris say anything like that, and that they should not base their decisions on what a convicted felon who based his entire career on lying and cheating said while rambling at his own rally. Including the racist lie that Obama was not born in the US, which is how he launched his political career. That his decisions and misinformation related to COVID resulted in more civilian American deaths than, oh I don't know, anything? And that yes, while there are things that need to be addressed in this country, he is not capable of doing that. Or something like that?

Also, one can note, as others have, that maybe misogyny and racism did not have as much to do with the results, but calling that argument "lazy" is disrespectful when these are the very foundations on which this country was built upon (i.e., taking advantage of non-white-male segments of the population) and are very much alive today. Regarding the economy and inflation, all those things were forces that were not unique to America and were tied to the patterns during the COVID-19 pandemic globally. What was not unique, in my opinion, was the Biden Administration response, which, even with what you have noted, improved the conditions tremendously - i.e., things would have been much worse without the Inflation Reduction Act and the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law. Someone else mentioned the price of gasoline - it is interesting to me that before the election, they were lower than they had been in a long time (I can't be a hypocrite and say that this is because of Biden, because presidents cannot really influence this, and politicians should not campaign on this).

I am going to try to make my main point again, and that is:

1. Do I recognize that many people voted for him?
Yes, more than for Harris, which is why he won. This time, he even appears to be on track to win the popular vote.
2. Do I think that the reasons include current prices of goods, immigration, the economy, racism, and misogyny, but that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist/misogynist?
Yes.
3. Do I think that people have somehow found Trump's pattern of behavior - including racism, fascist tendencies, convictions related to hush money and sexual assaults (this one in civil court), having no idea how to run anything, let alone a country - not disqualifying and more acceptable than whatever issues and transgressions they have found with Harris?
Yes, obviously, he won.
4. Can I have a personal opinion that #3 above is unacceptable, whatever the reasons may be, and be outraged about it?
Yes, 100%.
5. Can I have a personal opinion that the economic and immigration reasons noted in #2 pale in comparison to the threat that he poses to this country and the world and that Harris would address those better anyway?
Yes, 100%.

[Electrochrome]

Remember, the Republican party is absolutely, in no way a cult.

He exposed how week our political system is, he proved he could make an entire party agree that 2+2=5, and anyone who didn't believe is now gone.

[ribbons69]

There are a lot of emotive arguments around this, and I'm happy to accept that people would rather vote for a rapist than a woman if it means their fuel and food are cheaper, but I'm not happy to accept that isn't misogynist.

[villiersterrace]

This is a horrible outcome but I'm not surprised. As others have pointed out, Harris didn't do enough to separate herself from Biden. Maybe she would have won if she had more time for a campaign or didn't rely on an album that is mostly popular with people that were gonna vote for her anyways. She's not great but she would have been so much better than Trump. The fact that he won the popular vote says a lot about Americans. I thought we were better than this.

[Icon]

I was devastated by the outcome of the election.
Not being American, I realise I must respect the American people’s vote. But I really wouldn’t have thought that the majority of American voters could ignore the danger of a completely deranged person like Trump for the unfounded promises of cheaper gas and food by said man. Having followed the discussion here, I completely agree with shredgum.

[Incoming!]

Some thoughts :

Misogyny still alive and well (look at early stats)

We are still fighting the US Civil War

Democrats still a mess

9 of 10 states voted down abortion ban

One country lived under the rule of a narcissist fascist for 13 years. We can handle another 4

There won’t be a January 6 uprising

Glad I saw TSOM play in US maybe for last time

Kansas City Chiefs American football ball team won in over time last night. They are now 8-0

Let’s all pray for the US Joint Chiefs to once again have a back up plan if Trump moves his fingers to initiate nuclear use

Ok. My comments were too simplistic and trite. And I shouldn’t have lead off with the misogyny comment. The comparisons that came in during the day showed different results. Specific to the election misogyny was not an issue. Misogyny in the US in general does exist still imho.

There is a lot of thoughts weaved into the Civil War and democrats a mess comments. Mostly covered by all of you.

I did notice no one made reference to the 13 years of fascist control and the nuke comments. I watched a 3 hour documentary on the Nuremberg trials yesterday. There were details I had not known before. I worry about that thing happening in the US from all sides.

My choice in voting came down foreign affairs and the nuclear issue. We have a president elect who openly Putin. Made friends with North Korea Iran and China. Those who voted worried about the treatment of the Palestinians should expect something worse. My focus.

My second concern since I used to work in the Nuclear Security Enterprise is a focus. If anyone wants to know specifically the US approach should read the Nuclear Posture Review each President generates. Obama was pro nuke. Search internet. On White House website.

There were mechanisms placed under Trumps last term regarding a to stop a free wheeling use of nukes. I read that on a conspiracy website so who knows. But that is a concern of mine for all presidents. More than others.

Now having the Kansas City chiefs in first place in there decision is like having your favorite soccer club in the same position.

[sultan2075]

@sultan2075

First of all, yes, you are right, there have been conflicts during the Obama years (as well as Obama and Trump drone attacks), but my point is that in terms of the scale of these conflicts, it has been less than before, in comparison to Iraq and Afghanistan. I feel bad for saying this, because one civilian casualty is one too many, but I just don't know how else to describe it.

Back to your other points - when you say that I am "too outraged," you are no longer providing an explanation and theories (which is what everyone else seems to be doing), but you are providing justifications and telling me how to feel. Did you not read my point about Trump trying to forcefully overturn results of an election, while Harris peacefully congratulated her opponent? Did he not call the Georgia Secretary of State and tell him to "find him some 15,000 votes", or whatever it was? Did his mob not attack the Capitol on January 6 and chant "hang Mike Pence"? Is that not a reason to be fearful? His own chief of staff called him a fascist.

Hopefully, when your young students said that they were going to vote for Trump because they did not want to get drafted, you noted to them that they should use their critical thinking skills more - i.e., that draft has not been around for 50+ years, that this is a debunked claim and that at no point did Harris say anything like that, and that they should not base their decisions on what a convicted felon who based his entire career on lying and cheating said while rambling at his own rally. Including the racist lie that Obama was not born in the US, which is how he launched his political career. That his decisions and misinformation related to COVID resulted in more civilian American deaths than, oh I don't know, anything? And that yes, while there are things that need to be addressed in this country, he is not capable of doing that. Or something like that?

Also, one can note, as others have, that maybe misogyny and racism did not have as much to do with the results, but calling that argument "lazy" is disrespectful when these are the very foundations on which this country was built upon (i.e., taking advantage of non-white-male segments of the population) and are very much alive today. Regarding the economy and inflation, all those things were forces that were not unique to America and were tied to the patterns during the COVID-19 pandemic globally. What was not unique, in my opinion, was the Biden Administration response, which, even with what you have noted, improved the conditions tremendously - i.e., things would have been much worse without the Inflation Reduction Act and the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law. Someone else mentioned the price of gasoline - it is interesting to me that before the election, they were lower than they had been in a long time (I can't be a hypocrite and say that this is because of Biden, because presidents cannot really influence this, and politicians should not campaign on this).

I am going to try to make my main point again, and that is:

1. Do I recognize that many people voted for him?
Yes, more than for Harris, which is why he won. This time, he even appears to be on track to win the popular vote.
2. Do I think that the reasons include current prices of goods, immigration, the economy, racism, and misogyny, but that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist/misogynist?
Yes.
3. Do I think that people have somehow found Trump's pattern of behavior - including racism, fascist tendencies, convictions related to hush money and sexual assaults (this one in civil court), having no idea how to run anything, let alone a country - not disqualifying and more acceptable than whatever issues and transgressions they have found with Harris?
Yes, obviously, he won.
4. Can I have a personal opinion that #3 above is unacceptable, whatever the reasons may be, and be outraged about it?
Yes, 100%.
5. Can I have a personal opinion that the economic and immigration reasons noted in #2 pale in comparison to the threat that he poses to this country and the world and that Harris would address those better anyway?
Yes, 100%.

You seem to think I am making a normative claim. I’m not. Again: I didn’t vote for him and I’m not justifying anything. I am explaining why he won. I’m glad you think I should argue with my students about their fears. Personally I don’t think that’s my job. I wouldn’t be any good at it if it were. I don’t really care about their fears. I’m not a therapist. I’m not a parent. I’m not a clergyman of some kind.

You might consider the possibility that moralism, especially moralistic outrage, is often an obstacle to clear thinking. You can think everyone is evil or foolish, or you can try to understand why people choose differently than you yourself would under similar circumstances. Most of the time, the one is an obstacle to the other.

[sharedgum]

@sultan2075

First of all, yes, you are right, there have been conflicts during the Obama years (as well as Obama and Trump drone attacks), but my point is that in terms of the scale of these conflicts, it has been less than before, in comparison to Iraq and Afghanistan. I feel bad for saying this, because one civilian casualty is one too many, but I just don't know how else to describe it.

Back to your other points - when you say that I am "too outraged," you are no longer providing an explanation and theories (which is what everyone else seems to be doing), but you are providing justifications and telling me how to feel. Did you not read my point about Trump trying to forcefully overturn results of an election, while Harris peacefully congratulated her opponent? Did he not call the Georgia Secretary of State and tell him to "find him some 15,000 votes", or whatever it was? Did his mob not attack the Capitol on January 6 and chant "hang Mike Pence"? Is that not a reason to be fearful? His own chief of staff called him a fascist.

Hopefully, when your young students said that they were going to vote for Trump because they did not want to get drafted, you noted to them that they should use their critical thinking skills more - i.e., that draft has not been around for 50+ years, that this is a debunked claim and that at no point did Harris say anything like that, and that they should not base their decisions on what a convicted felon who based his entire career on lying and cheating said while rambling at his own rally. Including the racist lie that Obama was not born in the US, which is how he launched his political career. That his decisions and misinformation related to COVID resulted in more civilian American deaths than, oh I don't know, anything? And that yes, while there are things that need to be addressed in this country, he is not capable of doing that. Or something like that?

Also, one can note, as others have, that maybe misogyny and racism did not have as much to do with the results, but calling that argument "lazy" is disrespectful when these are the very foundations on which this country was built upon (i.e., taking advantage of non-white-male segments of the population) and are very much alive today. Regarding the economy and inflation, all those things were forces that were not unique to America and were tied to the patterns during the COVID-19 pandemic globally. What was not unique, in my opinion, was the Biden Administration response, which, even with what you have noted, improved the conditions tremendously - i.e., things would have been much worse without the Inflation Reduction Act and the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law. Someone else mentioned the price of gasoline - it is interesting to me that before the election, they were lower than they had been in a long time (I can't be a hypocrite and say that this is because of Biden, because presidents cannot really influence this, and politicians should not campaign on this).

I am going to try to make my main point again, and that is:

1. Do I recognize that many people voted for him?
Yes, more than for Harris, which is why he won. This time, he even appears to be on track to win the popular vote.
2. Do I think that the reasons include current prices of goods, immigration, the economy, racism, and misogyny, but that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist/misogynist?
Yes.
3. Do I think that people have somehow found Trump's pattern of behavior - including racism, fascist tendencies, convictions related to hush money and sexual assaults (this one in civil court), having no idea how to run anything, let alone a country - not disqualifying and more acceptable than whatever issues and transgressions they have found with Harris?
Yes, obviously, he won.
4. Can I have a personal opinion that #3 above is unacceptable, whatever the reasons may be, and be outraged about it?
Yes, 100%.
5. Can I have a personal opinion that the economic and immigration reasons noted in #2 pale in comparison to the threat that he poses to this country and the world and that Harris would address those better anyway?
Yes, 100%.

You seem to think I am making a normative claim. I’m not. Again: I didn’t vote for him and I’m not justifying anything. I am explaining why he won. I’m glad you think I should argue with my students about their fears. Personally I don’t think that’s my job. I wouldn’t be any good at it if it were. I don’t really care about their fears. I’m not a therapist. I’m not a parent. I’m not a clergyman of some kind.

You might consider the possibility that moralism, especially moralistic outrage, is often an obstacle to clear thinking. You can think everyone is evil or foolish, or you can try to understand why people choose differently than you yourself would under similar circumstances. Most of the time, the one is an obstacle to the other.

I think that you may have your opinions on the reasons that he won and that I may have my opinions on the matter, and that's fine. However, even if you did not vote for him, I disagree with you that you are not justifying anything, because you are making all kinds of "normative" statements such as "you are too outraged" and so on. Regarding your students, I noted that you should encourage critical thinking. For example, when they say - "Hey, I don't want to vote for Harris because I will be drafted and sent to Ukraine," I am not suggesting arguing about their fears. Maybe you did this anyway, but my follow up questions would be - "What is your source? Based on the previous experience with this source, has this source proven to provide reliable information?"

As I noted earlier, in my opinion, it is disrespectful to say that stating that misogyny and racism had an impact on the election outcome is a "lazy" argument for justifying Trump's victory when these "principles" are very much embedded in the fabric of this country (stating that you are not sure to what extent they contributed would be more acceptable to me than lazy). And I think that it is especially telling where your sympathies lie in this affair, even if you did not vote for him, when you note that "Harris is notoriously stupid and lazy" based on the info from the DC circles, when she was literally running against the stupidest and laziest person in the entire America, maybe the world (a hyperbole, but not too far off?). And yes, I can use my own eyes and ears to make this determination, it is not even close.

So, given what happened in this election, I am only arguing that I have every right to be outraged that I have to tell my children that our recently elected president is someone who was found liable for sexual abuse, convicted of financial crimes, and someone who has no regard for the democracy and whose mob tried to forcefully topple the government and threatened to hang his vice president. To me, it is perfectly reasonable to be outraged about that.

Having said all this, I am not a sadist, I have children, and I am only hoping that somehow, don't know exactly how, but I am hoping, that after four years, people everywhere are more prosperous, human rights are better than they are today, that all the major wars have ended, that crime rates in this country are down, and that we continue to address climate change. However, his first batch of cabinet appointments has not exactly instilled any confidence that this is what will be happening but let's see (I REALLY TRULY don't want to be telling anyone "told you so" on any of this).

[sultan2075]

@sultan2075

First of all, yes, you are right, there have been conflicts during the Obama years (as well as Obama and Trump drone attacks), but my point is that in terms of the scale of these conflicts, it has been less than before, in comparison to Iraq and Afghanistan. I feel bad for saying this, because one civilian casualty is one too many, but I just don't know how else to describe it.

Back to your other points - when you say that I am "too outraged," you are no longer providing an explanation and theories (which is what everyone else seems to be doing), but you are providing justifications and telling me how to feel. Did you not read my point about Trump trying to forcefully overturn results of an election, while Harris peacefully congratulated her opponent? Did he not call the Georgia Secretary of State and tell him to "find him some 15,000 votes", or whatever it was? Did his mob not attack the Capitol on January 6 and chant "hang Mike Pence"? Is that not a reason to be fearful? His own chief of staff called him a fascist.

Hopefully, when your young students said that they were going to vote for Trump because they did not want to get drafted, you noted to them that they should use their critical thinking skills more - i.e., that draft has not been around for 50+ years, that this is a debunked claim and that at no point did Harris say anything like that, and that they should not base their decisions on what a convicted felon who based his entire career on lying and cheating said while rambling at his own rally. Including the racist lie that Obama was not born in the US, which is how he launched his political career. That his decisions and misinformation related to COVID resulted in more civilian American deaths than, oh I don't know, anything? And that yes, while there are things that need to be addressed in this country, he is not capable of doing that. Or something like that?

Also, one can note, as others have, that maybe misogyny and racism did not have as much to do with the results, but calling that argument "lazy" is disrespectful when these are the very foundations on which this country was built upon (i.e., taking advantage of non-white-male segments of the population) and are very much alive today. Regarding the economy and inflation, all those things were forces that were not unique to America and were tied to the patterns during the COVID-19 pandemic globally. What was not unique, in my opinion, was the Biden Administration response, which, even with what you have noted, improved the conditions tremendously - i.e., things would have been much worse without the Inflation Reduction Act and the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law. Someone else mentioned the price of gasoline - it is interesting to me that before the election, they were lower than they had been in a long time (I can't be a hypocrite and say that this is because of Biden, because presidents cannot really influence this, and politicians should not campaign on this).

I am going to try to make my main point again, and that is:

1. Do I recognize that many people voted for him?
Yes, more than for Harris, which is why he won. This time, he even appears to be on track to win the popular vote.
2. Do I think that the reasons include current prices of goods, immigration, the economy, racism, and misogyny, but that not everyone who voted for Trump is a racist/misogynist?
Yes.
3. Do I think that people have somehow found Trump's pattern of behavior - including racism, fascist tendencies, convictions related to hush money and sexual assaults (this one in civil court), having no idea how to run anything, let alone a country - not disqualifying and more acceptable than whatever issues and transgressions they have found with Harris?
Yes, obviously, he won.
4. Can I have a personal opinion that #3 above is unacceptable, whatever the reasons may be, and be outraged about it?
Yes, 100%.
5. Can I have a personal opinion that the economic and immigration reasons noted in #2 pale in comparison to the threat that he poses to this country and the world and that Harris would address those better anyway?
Yes, 100%.

You seem to think I am making a normative claim. I’m not. Again: I didn’t vote for him and I’m not justifying anything. I am explaining why he won. I’m glad you think I should argue with my students about their fears. Personally I don’t think that’s my job. I wouldn’t be any good at it if it were. I don’t really care about their fears. I’m not a therapist. I’m not a parent. I’m not a clergyman of some kind.

You might consider the possibility that moralism, especially moralistic outrage, is often an obstacle to clear thinking. You can think everyone is evil or foolish, or you can try to understand why people choose differently than you yourself would under similar circumstances. Most of the time, the one is an obstacle to the other.

I think that you may have your opinions on the reasons that he won and that I may have my opinions on the matter, and that's fine. However, even if you did not vote for him, I disagree with you that you are not justifying anything, because you are making all kinds of "normative" statements such as "you are too outraged" and so on. Regarding your students, I noted that you should encourage critical thinking. For example, when they say - "Hey, I don't want to vote for Harris because I will be drafted and sent to Ukraine," I am not suggesting arguing about their fears. Maybe you did this anyway, but my follow up questions would be - "What is your source? Based on the previous experience with this source, has this source proven to provide reliable information?"

As I noted earlier, in my opinion, it is disrespectful to say that stating that misogyny and racism had an impact on the election outcome is a "lazy" argument for justifying Trump's victory when these "principles" are very much embedded in the fabric of this country (stating that you are not sure to what extent they contributed would be more acceptable to me than lazy). And I think that it is especially telling where your sympathies lie in this affair, even if you did not vote for him, when you note that "Harris is notoriously stupid and lazy" based on the info from the DC circles, when she was literally running against the stupidest and laziest person in the entire America, maybe the world (a hyperbole, but not too far off?). And yes, I can use my own eyes and ears to make this determination, it is not even close.

So, given what happened in this election, I am only arguing that I have every right to be outraged that I have to tell my children that our recently elected president is someone who was found liable for sexual abuse, convicted of financial crimes, and someone who has no regard for the democracy and whose mob tried to forcefully topple the government and threatened to hang his vice president. To me, it is perfectly reasonable to be outraged about that.

Having said all this, I am not a sadist, I have children, and I am only hoping that somehow, don't know exactly how, but I am hoping, that after four years, people everywhere are more prosperous, human rights are better than they are today, that all the major wars have ended, that crime rates in this country are down, and that we continue to address climate change. However, his first batch of cabinet appointments has not exactly instilled any confidence that this is what will be happening but let's see (I REALLY TRULY don't want to be telling anyone "told you so" on any of this).

If anything, “you are too outraged” is an epistemological rather than normative statement in this context. Moralism of every kind often interferes with clear thinking. As I believe I have already stated one can be outraged, or one can understand why people who choose differently than oneself would choose have chosen as they did. I further suggested that the two are often mutually exclusive: understanding why others choose and act as they do often prevents outrage, and outrage often prevents such understanding.

I’m not telling you how to feel. I don’t care how you feel and I couldn’t do anything about it even if I did.

As for my sympathies you’ve got that wrong too, but go ahead and make all the assumptions you want. I live and work in DC, and quite a few people in my circle have met or worked with the VP personally, including my wife.