The sisters:modernism with or without the 'post' prefix?

[nick the stripper]

The distinction between modernism and postmodernism has always seemed barren to me. Furthermore, I believe each artist should be taken on his own terms. Nonetheless, I embarrassingly admit that sorting artists into categories can make for what I consider interesting conversation. Often it can shed light on some faucet, however slight, even if the notion of categorization is a load of nonsense (are the Nephilim first or second generation Goth?).

It occurred to me that I could go straight to the source to answer the question. But after reading through this, it became apparent that this would be pointless, since Andrew Eldritch seems to have no idea about what he is talking about when it comes to postmodernism.

For example:

As you may have gathered, the Sisters are a political animal. And caring about anything is so uncool. Too bad.

I can, off the top of my head, list several "postmodernists" who cared deeply about politics, to the extent of actually taking action. In philosophy, to name two names, there is Foucault and Deleuze. Both were classed postmodern (against their will, which seems to be the case with all postmodernists, as it is with certain people and the Goth label ), and both were ardent activists within Palestine liberation, gay rights and prison reform. In addition, Foucault seems to share Eldritch's respect for Anarcho-Syndicalism.

Now postmodernism seems to me to be a pejorative categorization for (A) modernists who are far too critical of the Enlightenment for the likes of Sokal and Dawkins, (B) modernists who treat fragmentation and discontinuity positively rather than negatively, and (C) modernists who don't see fragmentation and discontinuity as something which can be transcended. An example is William S. Burroughs: in his notion of the habit and the fix is presented the impossibility of transcending irrational, economically imbued desires, and in his cut-up technique is found the affirmation of fragmentation and discontinuity. Of course, all three do not have to be internalized by an artist to be classified postmodern (you only need to pass A and be slightly sceptical to be classified postmodern by Sokal); after all, this makes it a lot easier to pigeonhole people.

Andrew Eldritch seems to be dismissing a wide range of thinkers (although he may simply be using the dichotomy to highlight several of his dislikes, such as prioritizing muesli over human rights), but in doing so, he's doing what he loathes (perhaps jokingly). If I wished, I could easily stretch statements (the sisters are a band for a hard world, but a hard world you can get off on) until they extend over the barrier and land in the realm of affirmation of différence. But I shall leave that up to you after asking you this: are the Sisters modern or postmodern?

[weebleswobble]

welcome back stripper boy, in a truly splendid stripper fashion

[6FeetOver]

I find pigeonholes (and pigeonholing) irritating as f*ck.

[weebleswobble]

I find sand down the crack of me bum a large irratent

[smiscandlon]

I find pigeonholes (and pigeonholing) irritating as f*ck.

The fat one wants to be your friend.

[6FeetOver]

I find sand down the crack of me bum a large irratent

I avoid such perils by not placing the crack of me bum remotely near any sand.

[6FeetOver]

I find pigeonholes (and pigeonholing) irritating as f*ck.

The fat one wants to be your friend.

That's cool, as I do actually like pigeons.

[smiscandlon]

I find pigeonholes (and pigeonholing) irritating as f*ck.

The fat one wants to be your friend.

That's cool, as I do actually like pigeons.

But not shoving them in holes?

[6FeetOver]

Correct. That's just mean.

[nick the stripper]

Correct. That's just mean.

Only if it isn't consensual.

[weebleswobble]

Correct. That's just mean.

Only if it isn't consensual.

obviously

[6FeetOver]

I love aminals - but NOT *that way*.
Sickos, the lot o' ye.

[smiscandlon]

I love aminals - but NOT *that way*.
Sickos, the lot o' ye.

No-one on this forum will ever think of "pigeon-holing" in quite the same way...

[6FeetOver]

...and whose fault is that, now?

[Dark]

I was just wondering earlier where you'd been.. typing that post, obviously.
Welcome back Strick von Nipper.

[nick the stripper]

I was just wondering earlier where you'd been.. typing that post, obviously.

And much more than that. Besides voluptuous criticism of obscure articles by obscure Goth bands, I have been working on a critique of foundationalism and developing a novel that dissolves linguistic distinctions necessary for language (it's quite unreadable).

[weebleswobble]

I was just wondering earlier where you'd been.. typing that post, obviously.

And much more than that. Besides voluptuous criticism of obscure articles by obscure Goth bands, I have been working on a critique of foundationalism and developing a novel that dissolves linguistic distinctions necessary for language (it's quite unreadable).

f**king hell, so have I!

[6FeetOver]

[6FeetOver]

...and developing a novel that dissolves linguistic distinctions necessary for language (it's quite unreadable).

Send it to me when you're done, will you?

[Karst]

Oh, the Sisters are very postmodern - because they are so obviously ironic.

[silentNate]

Oh, the Sisters are very postmodern - because they are so obviously ironic.

Exactly- I'm suprised Eldritch is still able to take his tongue out of his mouth in order to sing

[Quiff Boy]

after that amount of drugs i'm surprised he can keep it in his mouth and stop it lolling about

[MrChris]

Why begin a post by saying that the distinction between modernism and postmodernism has always seemed barren to you, and then end it by asking 'the Sisters: modern or postmodern'?

Or am I just being shamelessly foundationalist?

[million voices]

This is way out of my depth so I am asking a question rather than answering any.

But for something to be "modern" with or without the "post" prefix doesnt it have to be current? - which the Sisters certainly aren't

Or is there a line now drawn where everything after is modern. what happens when I need to describe something that is even more recent than post-modern?

Is that post-post-modern or pre-future?

My answer is that the Sisters are neither

[Dr. Moody]

are the sisters post-mortem